Ahhh, the Family Support Groups. When they are good, they are very, very good! And when they are bad… Well, then they make the evening news.
A little while ago, RedLegMeg touched on this very issue when she wrote about her FRG discussing a “First Kiss Raffle” as a fundraiser. Emotions were high on that one, and it’s not hard to see why. Nor did everyone agree – many spouses were absolutely fine with this idea for a fundraiser.
We recently received a mailbag letter from L on somewhat the same subject:
Personally, I do not have contact with my FRG. I work full time and a lot of overtime,then when I get home I have our daughter to take care of. Imagine my surprise [this information was given out only at a meeting] I find out that they have a raffle to pick your hubby up at the airport. Now, being a submariner, we generally dont get this option at all, its pick up and drop off at 3 am in the morning. The point is, the FRG groups should not have the “power” over peoples lives like they do. I work, I don’t know if they do or not, but I have to, end of story. I do not have any people I know from the boat, we have chosen to keep his career and our lives totally separate. The last time I tried to get information from my FRG, I was told that it was not an option: I either go to the meeting or I find out soon enough. Unbelievable.
I said somewhat the same topic, because the raffle obviously isn’t the only issue at play in this letter. There seems to be a breakdown in communication at the family support level – at least from the information we were given. I wish I could say this rarely happens, but unfortunately, that’s not necessarily the case.
When my grandfather was fighting in World War II, my grandmother had her own run-ins with other military spouses at Victorville. If you were one of the lucky ones who met my grandma in San Diego, you know that she is a pistol. She managed to figure out a way to get the information she needed and work around the difficult personalities in the group – but to this day she has some doozies of stories to tell about it! I’m pretty sure you could talk to Wives Groups of the Civil War and hear the same complaint.
The problem is that anytime you have a group that exists to fulfill information purposes, it becomes very easy for that to be abused – even if the rules are all being followed. Particularly when they are staffed entirely by volunteers, people’s feelings can get hurt, leading to a downward spiral resulting in an emotional knock-down, drag-out more raw than the time Geraldo got his nose broken by a skinhead. It’s an emotional minefield.
Another problem is one of being disconnected. I understand the urge to separate oneself from military issues, believe me. Even when we’re being assured that office politics are being kept out of the situation, they’re often still there. And as a spouse, it’s frustrating to have our words and actions measured against our active duty partner. It’s frustrating and it’s not fair. And sometimes we just want to get away from it all. We have things to do and schedules to keep, and if a spouse group is unwilling to be understanding of that fact it is easy to throw a one-finger salute to the whole thing.
The problem is that by cutting our ties, we also cut our support lines. An FRG may be disfunctional, but not everyone involved with the unit will be. Just as our spouses need battle-buddies to get them safely through deployments, so do spouses. It’s not just to get together and talk about child-rearing milestones over coffee, but to exchange information and look out for one-another.
Sometimes, we are all we have.
And since we are here as a virtual spouse support group, what advice do SpouseBUZZ readers have for L on this?
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Yuck, I can't believe she was told to show up at the meetings or just be uninformed.I'm not involved with my FRG, but I am on their email list and a fan of their Facebook page – I find those two things let me remain informed about what's happening on base without actually interacting with them.
And for support when my husband's gone, I turn to sailors in his division and their wives. I can't imagine not knowing any of them – in addition to keeping me updated on changes in my husband's schedule while he's gone, they just generally "get it" more than anyone else does. When my husband is gone, the sailors and wives are like my family, stepping in to fill the void and make sure I'm doing ok. I'd encourage L to try to make friends with at least one person on her husband's boat. Chances are there's at least one other wife who feels the same way as she does — and that wife might be willing to let her know what's going on when the FRG won't.
Interesting. Some spouses groups are trying to break those barriers and stereotypes.
in a way, this is her fault. if she has CHOSE to be disconnected from them. then why would they go out of their way to inform her? and im sure this is how they feel. im not one of those women deep into FRG land. but i stay connected. i e-mail my POC once a month. we're on deployment so its super important more then ever to stay connected. i dont attend meetings but because i make a point to go out of my way to get informed, they go out of their way to inform me. i think by choosing to disconnect herself completely, they have chose to do the same. is it right? no. should the FRG always be there, no matter what? yes. but she has obviously upset some people with her attitude towards the military life. and even though FRG's arent supposed to play favorites, or be closed minded… they are real people. and they come with all different personality types. she needs to either choose to involve herself or not. and cant complain when she chooses the latter and then isnt informed.
They would go out of their way to inform her because that's their job. They are volunteers who have agreed to support and inform the families, period. According to L, she tried contacting her FRG for information and they blew her off so something is very wrong there. Yes they are real people, but if they're so easily butthurt over a woman daring to not attend their meetings then they probably should not be in the position they're in. They are not gatekeepers to bestow information from on high to their chosen favorites, they are there to serve the families. All of them.
Here's a story: At a company level (this was 17 years ago) there was one wife (we'll call her "Rose") who didn't want to have anything to do with the FRG. She didn't want anything to do with us. She was prior service and as far as she was concerned, the wives were useless. So she went over the company commander's head and sought out the battalion commander and told him that she didn't want anything to do with the FRG. So he said "roger that" and the battalion deployed for 8 weeks. When the companies started flying back, the schedule was changed dramatically and no one called Rose to tell her when her husband was coming home. So when he arrived home, she wasn't there. She later screamed (and yes, I do mean screamed) at the battalion commander and he quickly said, "I'm sorry Rose, but you asked not to be contacted by the FRG for anything, so we didn't contact you". If you choose to disconnect yourself from the FRG, that is your choice, however, by doing that, you also choose to miss out on important information. However, I do agree that entering a raffle to pick up your husband is unfair and can't possibly include everyone. What about the wives who move away from the post/city during a deployment? They can't possibly attend a meeting in person to learn about information that is ONLY given out at a meeting (and not via e-mail or on Facebook or by phone). The raffle is unfair to those wives as well. However, just because you moved away doesn't mean you have to disconnect from the FRG — but you also can't attend a meeting in person to find out there's a raffle to pick up your husband? How would you know about this if you rolled back into town just in time to pick him up, only to learn that you couldn't? That said, I agree with Jessica in that she really doesn't have any room to complain. She chose to disconnect herself from the FRG and by doing so, she forfeited any right to information from the FRG. If you choose to disconnect, you choose to not be informed. The thing about the military — there are spouses out there who can tell me all they want about keeping their life separate from their husband's career, but the Army/Navy/Air Force/Marines are far more than just a career. This is a lifestyle that we lead and walking around saying "It's just his job and I stay out of it" is fooling yourself. He doesn't work for McDonald's or even AT&T. He serves his country and your life is intertwined with his life … and his lifestyle … for as long as he serves. And I second the notion that you can't find anyone who is going to understand what you are going through (as well as what's going on in the unit) better than another wife in the unit. While you may not want to be active in the FRG, you can still stay connected with someone in the unit that you get along with and that person can let you know what's going on.
I'm not goiing to touch the raffle thing this time, but I will say this:
There has to be a happy medium between "do not contact" and "I heart the FRG." With the variety of social media options out there and the structure of POCs, everyone should be able to get all the information they need without being so in touch as to be called "involved." I am hesitant to really participate in an FRG because, well, I think people should save their drama for their mama. But I do want to know what's going on, be informed and be active and available to help when catastrophe strikes. I also like being friends with the people whose husbands my husband is standing next to when the bombs are going off.
There are stories- real stories – about those who asked to be totally discounted and then encountered the worst circumstances, including health catastrophes of their own, and then found themselves begging the FRG for help because they had no where else to go.
Surely balance is possible — right?
Absolutely, there is balance! There should be balance. My recommendation on how to fix the "do not contact" fiasco is to persuade the Commander (FRG is a commander's program) to re-educate everyone on how the Privacy act statement works; its not a permission slip it is a notification claus. If it is Commander's disgression, everyone will be contacted. However, they can identify at which level they want to be contacted.
When I was FRG Leader we had a "red, white and blue" policy. Red: Contact for urgent troop movement activities only, deployments, deployment briefings, redeployment, etc. White: all of the above plus official business, like FRG meetings, community updates/activities, military family benefits, etc. and finally Blue: all of the above, plus "feel free to call me if you need brownies made for a bake sale." or "tell me about the FRG Christmas Party" or other purely social events. When I inherited the FRG there were 133 spouses associated with the FRG and only 53 were on the 'contact list'– everyone else was on a 'no contact list'. The Commander and I worked to call everyone associated with the unit personally. It took several evenings of calling, but it worked beautifully. We cleared the "no contact" list and enhanced the FRG's productivity.
What do you do when you were the key spouse, resigned due to health issues and apparently the commanders wife took offense? Now, not only have their been rumors started about me, but I no longer get any info or invites from the squadron (and you can't say it is because they don't have my info or I didn't put myself out there….and to make it worse, we are an EFMP family). At our last base I led my life and he led his due to being burned by a spouse group previously. Life was bliss. I thought at a new base I would give it a shot again since I didn't plan to have a career here. Well, see where that got me….never again. Frustrates me because I like to be in the know but not at the cost of drama, pettiness and back-stabbing.
I don't see anything in that letter that says "No emails or Facebook please". She has her own life outside of being a military spouse, nothing wrong with that. Were is the rule that we have to find deployment support or "battle buddies" only from fellow military spouses or activities on post/base? From what I'm reading she is being punished for not attending the meetings.
I work full time and can't attend FRG meetings because they schedule them for 5PM and its never the same day. To get there on time I would have to leave 45 min – 1 hour early from work. Rush hour traffic, no time to eat, no time to get the kids from the babysitter. One, I cant do that every month, especially when we only get at best a five day notice. Two and more importantly , I shouldn't have to! I make no apologies when they call every so often and say "oh we missed you".
The point is, if you are going to run your meetings on the assumption that the spouses don't work (or there job is not as important) and their lives revolve around the FRG, the military, etc than you are going to turn off a lot of spouses. When you start "punishing" them they are not going to come to meetings and they are not going to want to get involved at the next duty station.
If FRG's are there for information why is this one not passing out that information?
I totally agree. I want to be involved with my frg as much as possible, but I'm also looking for full-time work. All our frg meetings take place in early evening when most people are just getting off work and all our get-togethers for the Marines and their families usually happen on Friday afternoons…when people who have 8-5 jobs are working. To mirror what you said, I find it kind of offensive that the frg operates under the assumption that spouses don't have lives outside the military. Even though it's not intentional, they exclude people by holding all their meetings and events at inconvenient times for working spouses.
when would be a better time? If the M-F is not good for those that work 8-5, M-F should they schedule a meeting on the weekend? I'm only asking this because I can understand your point of view. But when should the FRG schedule meetings? It just seems like there is no real true blue good time for FRG's to schedule meetings? Just a thought. I mean if they plan to hold a meeting at 7 or so then the problem of but that's an hour before Susie Maes bedtime? If they plan one for a weekend then it takes away from family time? It just sucks for most all the way around. There never seems to be a good time for some, most, or all. I believe that e-mail, FB, and calls should be made! It is not always easy but it can be accomplished with enough help and dedication. Volunteers can get burnt out the same way as those with a full-time job. It's no excuse but just what it is. No tone went into the typing of this reply ;)
As a full time working spouse, I CONSTANTLY get thrown to the wolves. I can't attend meetings and fund raisers that occur in the middle of the day (and at our post they ALL do). And I've gotten the "we have to worry about the kids speech". So essentially it's a system prejudiced against those of us that 1. don't have or want kids and 2. work full time
It should be one split meeting in the afternoon, next one in the evening. I am so sick and tired of getting the evil eye for not attending meetings and fundraisers because I CHOOSE to work and support our household. I'm tired of the nit picking and gossip when I can't attend coffees and having the cliques that stick together like glue.
I don't have a probelm with a 'first kiss' or any other raffle as a fund raiser. I may be biased, we "won" 2 years in a row. The key is that the raffle needs to be offered both shore side and for the active duty. My hubby won one of the years and the year I one, I only had 1 ticket that I got for a freebie at the one FRG meeting I attended just prior to coming home. It wasn't that important to me and I wasn't going to shell out any $ for it personally. That aside I find the FRG a necessary evil. I'm a moderate participant when pushed to be. Funny, she had a child to take care of and didn't want to go. I don't have children and didn't want to go be surrounded by kids after a full days work. In this day and age it's a lot easier to be connected and informed without having to attend meetings. I'm sorry she's had a bad experience, but like it was also said, these groups are run by real volunteer people.
I feel for her. I think that FRG's should be required to at least email the information given out at meetings to those who can not attend for whatever reason. And while her attitude to distance herself entirely from the military may not be the right one , I can somewhat understand her thought process, having been burned many times before by the FRG in my 10yrs doing this. However I do still try to put myself out there so I stay informed.
But during my Hubby's last deployment they deployed him from texas even thoiugh we are active duty stationed in GA, and the FRG there did not keep me informed at all and gave me no contact info at all. I had to rely on hubby. It was a nightmare.
So my advice to her is to try and be a lil kinder to them and make more of an effort with them and respectfully ask for emailed information and explain why she can not attend and just know that it will not last forever and she will eventually move and maybe the next command will be different. But Hugs to her, she is definitely not alone.
Hello, I am the FRG leader of a National Guard Unit currently deployed. I have been for 3 yrs & this time, nearing the end of our deployment is the most challenging. I was a soldier too, for almost 10 yrs & now the spouse of a soldier. I have a full time job, I am the chairperson of another volunteer group & I have a 3yr old &1yr old son, a house & 2 dogs to care for. As leader of the FRG I understand time constraints. I have NO extra time, there are days I forget to brush my teeth! We have a monthly meeting,newsletter, facebook group just our unit & I email info daily. I still have families who feel excluded & isolated. It is very challenging to reach people who seem to excluded themselves.
I wish I had you as our FRG leader my husbands 1st deployment. He has not deployed either time with his home unit but has been 'loaned out' to other units, in a different brigade even! (Sorry, I don't know the technical term for those types of orders.) Heck, I wish you were our FRG leader for his home unit, whom I haven't spoken to since running into her at Wal-mart (yes we live in the same town), during his last deployment 2 years ago! FRG info during his 1 year TDY between deployments, ha! (Yes, I have bitterness issues when I made a point of calling/emailing/texting/personally handing her my contact info and I still have NO IDEA when FRG meeting are!) If it weren't for the drill letters he would get, funny, now that I think about haven't seen one in months, I wouldn't have known what was going on. Even whenhubby was actually with his home unit for 6 months and made a point of asking repeatedly that I be added to the FRG info roster, was assured I was, still haven't seen anything.Still missed family days, dining out, volunteer opportunities. Who knows maybe they don't consider me a unit spouse since my hubby has only been with them about 6 months in the past 3.5 years, and a little over a year before beginning the cycle of going to other units.
The unit he's deployed with right now, LOVE THEM, some drama- yes, some cliqishnes – yes, how can there not be with a wide age/demographic/personality type, however, I have never felt excluded like hubby's home unit and as far as isolated..didn't give them the chance to make me fell like that, nor do I think anyone would. I get newsletters, emails, I know when the meetings are even though I am not always able to make them due to distace (2.5 hour drive for a 30 minute meeting on average, love they try to keep it brief because people are busy, but if its not a long one, I'll wait for the newsletter.). I've tried to connect with spouses in my husbands home unit…other than the FRG leader, couldn't tell you who they are if they were standing in front of me. His deploying unit I made a point of introducing myself, of asking if there was anyone living in our area and asking for an introduction. The FRG leader returns my emails as soon as she is able, usually within 72 hours. The difference is night and day…so the whole point to this rambling is that I am sure you are very appreciated by a lot of family memebers.
While it is true that if you attend FRG meetings, events, trainings, programs your voice is heard, that should not exclude you from the information. There are no requirements to participate, but the participants are not usually the ones who complain. The FRG is a group of volunteers who can only do what they feel best, if they are not supporting their families well they need to know that. I have provided surveys to get feedback, & during this deployment I have had 1 filled out. I struggle being professional as FRG leader, & being personal as I am also a soldier's wife & need my Battle Buddies too. Lastly, I will say that I hear all the time that "FRG is only for spouses", my reply is "FAMILY" readiness group, for parents, children, spouses, cousins, aunts, uncles, girlfriends/boyfriends, grandparents, anyone who loves a servicemember. In other words YOU are part of FRG whether you volunteer, attend, or participate. YOUR actions reflect on other military families whether you think so or not. (just as the service members actions reflect on the unit) So be the example you want to see from others!
As I said in previous post, sometimes it is the FRG volunteers, for whatever reason. In my case I have come to wonder since my husband has been deployed with other units or TDY'd individually 3 of the past 3.5 years, maybe they do not consider me a unit spouse. But I had on several occasions given our FRG president my contact info personally with verbal notification that I wanted to be involved…finally I gave up and thankfully have a great FRG with his current 'temperary' unit.
I am just fine with this as a fundraiser. Whats a few minutes longer to support your group? Sometimes things get too blown up over nothing.
As an Army Wife and as a leader my brain aches. A dozen or so classes, freely available on Army installations, myArmyOneSource and beyond, come to my mind. Has anyone heard of Army Family Team Building? Or OpREADY? Or the Military Family Life Consultants? All of these programs provide outstanding training to help leaders identify and assess needs, improve communication skills, motiviate groups, build teams and ultimately improve the effectiveness of the Family Readiness Group. Reading through these posts, I can see literally 'text book' examples of how to transform these negative experiences into positive success stories- through communication skills, understanding needs, leadership, team dynamics, etc.
It's not that sticky. For the spouse who thinks that the "First Kiss" raffle is unfair because the chose to move away and couldn't attend meetings for whatever reason then just deal with it. You win some you loose some it's not that big of a deal. What about the sacrifices those of us who stay at the duty station with no family no true friends and no real support system. We all make a choice. If mine allowed me to be present to put in a raffle ticket then you will just have to be okay with that. It raises a lot of money and is nothing to get in a huff over. You WILL get to kiss your spouse even if only a few minutes later.
Not everything can be posted online. There are good reasons why certain parts of these meetings are not released in the transcripts. If you want to know when your spouse is coming home ask them. Wives who form a lynch mob complaint group every time they don't get their way are so annoying. This practice is not meant to be divisive it's a good thing if you let it be.
I'm one of those people who has never had a good experience with FRGs. I gave it my best, but as a newbie, I just did not understand these women. I definitely have some soap opera stories from those deployment days, but at least I can say I tried. I did keep the group at a arms length always saying I had to work. We had a lot of bad stuff happening in each of my husband's squadrons and I just did not want to be reeled into it. I had plenty of stress at my own job. I always made my own friends (outside of the military) who supported me plenty! They might not have understood exactly what I was going through, but they were there for me without all of the drama!
I have three EFMP family members in my home. I can't use CYS care at all. I still want information. When I wanted ADA access for my son at a function, I was labeled a problem. The BN Commander's wife was nasty, outright hostile, and dragged my husband into it. He got one of those control your wife speeches. Why? Because at the last Christmas event we had to carry my son and his wheelchair up a flight of stairs, and nobody thought that was a big deal. I got some apologies, but nothing was changed, and we ran into the same access issues over and over again. Every contact after that with the FRG, got worse, and I was labeled ungrateful. I just wanted the same opportunities offered to everyone else. They wonder why we don't go to events.
I offered my help for online endeavors and dissemination of information because I could do that from home. Was I given the opportunity? No. Why? The BN FRG leader wanted to have complete control over what was being sent out. I found out that the information the FRSA was sending her was being filtered. The FRG leader only shared what she thought was pertinent. Blame is placed on many spouses for not updating their information. The last rotation, my information was checked and rechecked, and I got absolutely no contact from the FRG during the entire deployment. I reached out to get information and support, and got nowhere. I was not alone. That was the biggest complaint I have heard. I gave them my information, and I still got nothing. Fortunately, I managed through other channels.
EFMP families are underserved because they can't always participate in functions that other families can. I was actually given grief because I didn't attend enough meetings to "have a right to complain". Why would I attend? I can't even get my son's wheelchair in the door, and that isn't the only issue! It is hard enough for us to even leave the house, let alone drop everything when a meeting is announced two hours before it is supposed to start and my kids can't use CYS at all. When meetings are scheduled to meet the FRG leader's schedule without consideration to others needs, that is a problem as well. I shouldn't have to defend myself by airing my business to someone married to my husband's boss, explaining why I didn't go to a meeting, or function, or fundraiser. I'm a private person, and issues with OPSEC always come to mind when there is a public forum involved.
When the problem with the BN FRG leader escalated and I sought help, the FRSA expressed concern for her job if she mediated. I thought she was supposed to be impartial and be able to help in these situations. I don't want her to fear for her job. I never want to harm someone's career, even if it does help me. The BN commander sided with the BN FRG leader, because she was his wife, and what really happened and what she told him…I can't begin to guess. The Brigade Commander said that it was her "turn" to be FRG leader because her husband was in command. So leaders in positions of power should be chosen based on who they are married to? Why does one person get to control the information for an entire BN? With natural personality conflicts, there should always be more than one route to get what you need, like the chain of command, without actually having to involve the soldiers into it. The soldiers have better things to do than to mediate bickering spouses.
What I have found is that many of the volunteers are not in it for the right reasons. They use the FRG to highlight their resume, for political agendas for themselves or their spouses, or to air other people’s private business they become privy to. Power hungry, control freak, rank wearing spouses do nothing but harm to everyone involved. When trying to advocate for the little guys (new spouses, special needs families, single soldiers, families without children) and spouses who didn't know what to do, I heard over and over again, that if they wanted information, they had to ask, or get involved or volunteer. Too many spouses don't even know where to start. It shouldn't be that hard. Nobody should have to beg for information. Sometimes those “80 percent” don't have any way to help. Does that mean they don't deserve support and information? No. It means the system is broken. Nobody should sit on their soapbox and pretend to have any idea what every family is going through, and assume that because they aren't involved in the FRG they shouldn't get support.
One really horrid experience has ruined it for me. Never. ever. again.
The FRG volunteer model is based on a time when many women stayed home and had time to volunteer. The system doesn't need to be fixed. It needs to be done away with, and replaced with an entirely different model. Informal support is popping up all over groups on FB, Yahoo, and other social media outlets to fill a need that is not being met. That should speak volumes. Unfortunately, this leads to fragmented information, incorrect information, drama filled groups, and drama of it’s own unless the group is run in a professional objective manner, which isn’t easy.
My biggest concern are for the spouses that are deliberately denied information and access by their sponsors, and those who have sponsors who don't know how to get them information and resources because they are so new to this, they themselves have no idea. So many spouses that are isolated, or victims of domestic violence have no idea that there are resources out there designed just for them, unless they are lucky enough to meet someone who knows and takes the time to outline it for them. Those are the spouses that need to know what support is there for them. How do we reach those spouses? Total communication. Legwork. There are options for written mail, FB, Twitter, phone calls, and house calls if need be. Last deployment all information was restricted to AKO, which most spouses don't know how to access. I have taught many soldiers how to get their spouses access, because they didn't even know they had that option. Because of sponsoring requirements and AKO's difficulty to navigate, that failed miserably as a support system. The BN was able to check off the box that support was offered, though. That said, not every spouse's needs can be met online. If a soldier is new to an installation, what about the time until they are settled into quarters and they don't have the internet? What about those who don't have the internet for other reasons. I know, hard to imagine, but families that aren’t wired are out there.
I hope that the military remembers that a happy family means a happy soldier. If the soldier knows that his/her family is safe and well cared for at home, he/she will reenlist at a higher rate, and be more productive.
Without trying to sound snarky…she should be happy she was given the information. I have been the wife of a sailor for almost 12 years and in those 12 years our current commands FRG/OMB dropped the ball. DH report to the command just over a year ago and he filled out the paperwork to give the OMB and I too emailed my info to the OMB. I did not hear from anyone and to be honest, I am too busy to get involved with FRG functions. Fast forward to now…the command goes out to sea for a very short deployment for 5days (No pre deployment night sioree). I knew what day the boat would be back, just not the time. How did I find out the boat was back? Facebook.
The following month, the boat has an official FRG pre-deployment night. Imagine the surprise on our faces when the command OMB has no information on us. And apparently there was another wife that was left out of the loop. To add insult to injury, the command was awarding the OMB for her job well done and was stepping down after her 1 yr term and a new OMB was taking her place.
I guess you could say after all the great commands we have been apart of, this FRG/former OMB has made this a memorable and not in a good way.