The blame for an Army spouse learning of her husband’s combat death via text last week rests squarely on the shoulders of other spouses within the unit, not on a failure of the Army notification process, a Fort Stewart official told SpouseBUZZ today.
“We stress to families and to spouses that there is an official process, and to be careful with information and operation security and other things like that – we stress that,” said Kevin Larson, a public affairs officer at Fort Stewart. “Truth can grow legs and change into rumor, and information is shared improperly before the Army can do the right thing.”
Megan Born, 22, learned Thursday first from a text message and then from a Facebook post that her husband, Sgt. Joshua Born had been killed in action earlier that day. Although her husband was stationed at Fort Stewart, Ga., Megan had moved home to Olive Branch, Ill. for the deployment.
A casualty notification team was on their way to deliver the news in person per Army protocol when the messages reached her through social media. After seeing the rumors Megan and her mom frantically phoned Fort Stewart officials looking for more information. Rather than deflect her questions, the Major in charge of her husband’s rear detachment confirmed the information to her over the phone.
Update: Megan’s mom and aunt left messages for our readers — see them here.
Larson said that the unit was under a communications blackout downrange, meaning that no calls or communication was to go out until Megan and Sgt. Born’s other next of kin, such as his parents, had been notified of his death. He declined to speculate as to just how the information was leaked. He said an investigation is being conducted downrange and within the unit at Fort Stewart over the inadvertent KIA notification text and Facebook posts.
So here’s the problem with this whole thing: the Army’s casualty notification process relies on a combination of trusting spouses who do have privileged information (whether rightly or wrongly – and sometimes they get it through no fault or action of their own … I know because I’ve been there) to keep their mouths shut, and those that don’t have information to not speculate when something is clearly amiss.
People are smart. … too smart to not wonder why their Soldier didn’t call at his “normal” time, and too smart to not put two-and-two together when two other friends’ Soldiers did the same thing. The situation screams “communications blackout” – then the rumor mill goes into action and people end up getting hurt. As we’ve seen in the comments over here, this isn’t the first time this has happened – just the first time it’s been so widely publicized.
So what’s the solution? Can we trust emotionally exhausted spouses to keep information to themselves? Can we hope that jumping up and down about OPSEC will get the job done? Jacey suggested Saturday that the DoD should come up with a faster way to deliver the news – but is there really a faster way that includes the proper dignity and respect that the “dark sedan” and “the knock” bring with them?
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It boggles my mind that any spouse with a functioning brain would think it appropriate to tell a woman her husband is dead with an effing text message. I mean, seriously.
Amen! How about a little sensitivity. It’s like people can’t wait to be first to deliver horrible news.
Bingo!! Let the people do their job and provide the notification and the support yhe spouse may need.
Although I agree, they may not have "told" her he died, but offered condolences for her loss. There's a HUGE difference in intent, though the end result sucks equally.
That is probably how it went down, but even then that is terrible. A truly sympathetic person would have gotten in a car and driven to her. To me this smacks of a “I got the information before you!” mentality that is far too prevalent.
Kyle….SERIOUSLY!!! THERE IS AN OFFICIAL PROCESS!!!!! Take your semantics elsewhere. When and where did you serve? You obviously don't understand the sensitivity of the process.
I think the point Kyle was getting at was that they were not aware that the wife had not been notified yet. I myself would assume that if I found out, the spouse must know since that's what the process is. They reached out to support her in her time of grief and need, it just happened at the wrong time. I'm positive they didn't do this to be insensitive or get a leg up on someone else by knowing first.
Samantha, as far as getting in the car and driving to her, she went home to her family in Illinois. He was stationed at Ft. Stewart, GA. That's a long trip to say I'm sorry for your loss, and frankly, unless it's a spouse with no children and no job, it's just not feasible financially or for someone with children.
Sorry Carol, I agree with Coop! The people who posted it onto Facebook and texted the spouse probably didn't give a flip about supporting her, both of them just wanted to "be the first" to offer condolences or tell them or whatever. If they've been in the military family/system for any length of time, they would know from the briefings that they, the unit spouses, would have been told through their own chain of command who had died AFTER the spouse and family had been notified. Their whole intent was to be first. That was their only concern.
My husband was KIA in Taji, Iraq on Jan. 6 of 2005. Our three sons were 11, 7 and 7 at the time of his death. I could in no way imagine finding out about his death on the Internet. I could, however, rationalize the thought that someone wouldn’t know how to express their condolences in person and truly understand the need to “text” their sorrow. Unfortunately, there are those people that need to feel they were the first to post! The process of the designated CAO contacting the next of kin is there fir a reason. With the speed of media, computers, phones, they try their best to be the first to notify next of kin. I found out first with that “knock on the door” but within the next hour media were pouring into my parents house. I have had nothin but positive interaction with the media. I pray this widow has the strength and support around her.
Ma'am, thank you very much for your faithfulness to your husband and for his sacrifice. God bless you and your family.
Even so… is offering condolences via Text message how we are doing things these days? If it were my husband I would smash my phone in to pieces if I had to keep getting text messages from people who could pick up a phone or take the time to write in a card. I think this situation deserves a more personal touch. Just my opinion
I agree… No one that has a heart would text a woman condolences after her husband’s recent death. I mean they could AT LEAST call… If anyone did that to me I would certainly not text them back or even consider them a friend for that matter.
Really, i would go Slap the Stupid @$$ Spouse who couldn't keep their mouth shout. Than kicked the fucking husband who leaked the information to his loud mouth Tramp. No Senstivity to those at all.
You stay classy…..
Keep up the doucheness Jeffrey.
I wouldn’t doubt the spouse who sent the text got the information from her husband. Some people have no sense of responsibility and don’t understand right and wrong. How by any stretch of the imagination could she think that this was an okay thing to do. She is probably one of the many spouses who think they don’t need to attend pre-deployment briefs.
Actually, Nancy, the SM of the person who posted it to Facebook should be punished under the UCMJ for failure to follow a written order. Then the spouse who posted it should be punished and also the spouse who texted her. My opinion from being both AC, USAR and a military spouse.
I agree with you that the person whomever leaked the info to the spouses should be punished by UCMJ. However, concerning those who texted or posted on facebook, that would apply only if they are the active/reserve military. Spouses are not in the military and therefore can not be held accountable to UCMJ. The most the military could do is ban her from post or reject her military privileges. While insensitive and cruel, I don’t think it is criminally/illegal to post such things in the civilian world. Although, I bet they could be sued in civil court. But, I doubt the widowed spouse is really worrying about that right now. My heart goes out to her!
A soldier's spouse is not in the military and therefore not subject to UCMJ; in that, you are correct. *However* the military does reserve the right to punish a soldier (via UCMJ) for what their spouse does; it's happened before. That is what dsmith meant.
Yea, I hear you, pretty tactless
Because a population of Army spouses, just like any Population are stupid, insensitive idiots! And the notification process is too long, there are too many people involved, the chain is too long, and Communication spreads too fast in Iraq and Afghanistan, even with Communications blackouts, I have heard too many stories of Personal Satelite Phones, and Personal Internet Satelites that don't have to adhere to the "Blackouts" Shame on anyone who would post a facebook comment about a soldiers death before the spouse were to hear about it. Then another question can be raised, did the spouse notify anyone that she was going home to Mom and Dads and would be at Ft. Stewart, in case something like that were to happen so that she could be properly notified? So many times I hear of Spouses who want NOTHING to do with the Family Readiness Groups, and refuse to give out their phone numbers or tell anyone where they are going, so it could be almost impossible to get hold of a spouse. It's a sad situation, but nonetheless, in case of death overseas, Facebook should be the LAST place something like that should be broadcast.
I couldn't agree more with you about the text message. The purpose of a "COMMUNICATIONS BLACKOUT DOWNRANGE" is suppose to insure that this kind of a situation doesn't happen. As a military spouse, I have enough respect for any and all of my fellow military families, to keep my fingers and my mouth silent and wait for the proper notification to the families of the loss of their "HERO". May God Bless All Our Servicemen for their Service To Our Country.
I think sometimes husbands are equally guilty for OPSEC breaches as wives can be. We men are given priveleged information and it is on a need to know basis for a vast majority of military functions. I can recall seeing an idiot co-worker posting on Facebook the date and port we were to arrive in via Facebook. On top of that, we were in a hazardous duty/imminent danger zone, which is not where i would be posting that info. So, in my conclusion, I believe husbands and wives should be equally accountable for OPSEC leaks. If the husband leaks OPSEC to his wife and his wife leaks it on Facebook, the husband should be punished as if it were him outright leaking the OPSEC.
So so true! I was thinking the same thing!
I will not say its the Husband or Wife what i will say is that the spouse should realize that they need to keep stuff to them selves and yes alot of soldiers do tell there spouses stuff they shouldn't but alot of soldiers do not feel they can talk to there chain of command about somthings or doctors and will only confied in there spouse, cant punish a soldier for that its stupid to do so i understand what opsec is for and why it is there but the rumor mill spouses have is rediculous and there fore is the big issue that needs to be adressed.
Unfortunately, immy, the people who did this probably don't think that the rules that were explained to them at the pre-deployment briefing didn't apply to them. They also probably don't participate in the unit's FRG, or if they do it's only minimal and they express discontent and hatred because they aren't in charge. Sad fact of military life, but true. I'm a military spouse, my spouse happens to be a commissioned officer and has been a unit Commander for a deployed unit. I was the FRG leader because the individual who had been running it was relieved because they went totally off the grid and refused communications with anyone, including the rest of the FRG, the FRG Adviser at Bde and the unit Commander. Felt they were too good to let anyone else know what was going on.
I think you mean military member and not husband… there are female members and male spouses… but I agree with the idea completely! As a former commander I even gave a few letters of reprimand and an Article 15 for members not keeping their mouth shut AS IS THE POLICY OF THE DoD! But individuals just have to run their mouths and look big to someone else even at the expense of another human's emotions.
I agree the deploying husbands tell the wife everything.. that's wrong.. My hubby has been deploy and I never know a thing I can't know and I get the info from battery spouses….
Actually, it was. Also, the charge in the UCMJ of "failure to control dependents" is there for that kind of thing.
not sure i like the wording of "failure to CONTROL dependants" the control the soldier failed in was his/her own by leaking the info to the family member in the first place. they know their spouses – and they know if they can keep secrets or understand the importance of allowing the system to run its process.
Maybe the soldier should have told his spouse to keep the info to herself since that family most likely hadn't been notified yet. It is the servicemember's responsibility to ensure that their families understand how these things are handled. When my husband tells me something related to his job and I am not sure of the sensitivity of the info I do ask if this is something that is just between us. In this instance, I have been around long enough to know to keep my mouth shut. We can't expect the commands and the FRGs to teach spouses how to conduct themselves in the military world. That education should be coming from the servicemember and if it is not happening then the servicemember should be held accountable when the crap hits the fan.
This info was undoubtedly passed on from soldiers to spouses to social networks. I worked an FRG and know this first hand, but we never told any info past what was given to us, we never added detail that wasn't given to us no matter who asked. People want to be the first to tell, they want others to depend on them for information not theirs to share and, in doing so, have no respect for the rest of their "family" in the unit….it's disgraceful
He WAS outright leaking OPSEC. The wife didn’t hear it from the tooth fairy.
Don't hit me! I'm just a lowly E-4. Same team!
AGREED!
Amy is right in noting that MILITARY PEOPLE ARE SMART. We really are good at learning to recognize what isn't normal and then adapting to the situation. To be fair, I can't imagine how the Army could be faster and still notify families in person–which I think is the most respectful way to go. One reader messaged me that maybe in situations like this the local police could be drawn in. Would that work?
No, I do not think that would be a good idea. Living remotely, if the police showed up at someone's house, it would be assumed(and I know what happens when one assumes something) that some one was being arrested or such. Whether it should be or not it would not appear good in the community.
This is a great time to make quick use of Army Guard and Army Reserve. I know it’s been done in the past. The Guard already has full time honor guard detachments for funeral honors in many states. Maybe rotate this as an additional duty to the NCO’s on these detachments. Might be a faster way to notify families.
Uh, Peter, we take care of our own…I'm not sending a stranger to one of my spouses home. Thanks for the offer, but no thanks. Someone from the unit will make the notification, I don't care if we have to fly to Alaska.
Coop, you posed this question earlier, and I must ask you…. When and where did you serve? Have you ever undergone Casualty Assistance Officer training? I’m going to take a shot in the dark that you haven’t. It is not always someone in a persons unit who notifies the families. Once you go through training, you are “on call” the remainder of your career. You could receive a call at any time to notify a family, regardless as to if you know the soldier or their unit. Eventually the unit/frg will step in to help the family with support, meals, what not…. But they are not the ones notifying the family. Please stop attacking ppl when you don’t know what you’re talking about.
Coop, speaking as a military spouse, former FRG leader, FRSA, and several other initials on military posts….
Most of the spouses have NO CLUE who the CAO is. Wouldn’t it be better to have a reservist or guardsman knock at your door before the Facebook nazi?
What’s bull about all this is that they don’t do the blackout soon enough, I learned my husband was seriously injuried from his Sgt wife. My husband was the soul survivor, but the blackout was not impulmented fast enough. Plus they wanna come up with a faster way of doin it. Well I have heard many spouses say I wanna know when you know, but if it’s between 10 pm an 6 am that rear detachment finds out the spouse will have to wait till their duty ours I think that outta go away. An really Facebook as a former FRG Leader @ Ft. Campbell in our training if we seen stuff on our wives wall we dealt with the problem right then an there an in every FRG meeting we had to stress OPSEC, but this is just horrifying I know my experience was…
What’s bull about all this is that they don’t do the blackout soon enough, I learned my husband was seriously injuried from his Sgt wife. My husband was the soul survivor, but the blackout was not impulmented fast enough. Plus they wanna come up with a faster way of doin it. Well I have heard many spouses say I wanna know when you know, but if it’s between 10 pm an 6 am that rear detachment finds out the spouse will have to wait till their duty ours I think that outta go away. An really Facebook as a former FRG Leader @ Ft. Campbell in our training if we seen stuff on our wives wall we dealt with the problem right then an there an in every FRG meeting we had to tell them not to say this an that. This is just horrifying I know my situation was..
Coop, speaking as a military spouse, former FRG leader, FRSA, and several other initials on military posts….
Most of the spouses have NO CLUE who the CAO is. Wouldn’t it be better to have a reservist or guardsman knock at your door before the Facebook idiot?
Coop, as someone who was on the receiving end of this, there is no good way to do it. Like I said in my first post I was told by a complete stranger that my older brother had died from his wounds. I did not learn the whole story until 2007. It took his best friend writing on the Virtual Vietnam wall in 2007 for our family to find out what really happened.
No. The Army sent them over there. They need to be the ones to do that. In situations where there is a small town…. how awful to be the police officer who has to notify your buddy's wife that he died. The Army needs to handle their own dirty work. I would be pissed if my husband (a Marine) was killed and the Marines didn't even have enough respect to send their condolences in person…. that they would hand pass the job over to someone else…. it's dismissive.
It would work only if they are knowledgeable in the services and support that is available from the militrary side that they get briefed on when the military makes the notifications.
The military uses units, active and reserve, in the local area to do notifications. Rarely is there a person more than 4 hours away from anyone doing the notification. For example: I was once notified to bear the message to a woman in Shreveport, LA when I was at Ft Polk…. about 2-2.5 hours depending on traffic. If the notification needed to be done 30 minutes more north, then another unit that was closer had the responsibility to bear the notification.
Not to mention then you have the possibility of another person leaking the information, the Military needs to be the ones making the notification.
Police notification would not work. The nco and officers who are sent out to notify a family have undergone specific training to notify the families. They are trained how to handle all sorts of situations and to give certain info needed immediately by the families.
American Red Cross or local crisis agency who have the trained personnel to do death notifications – which encompasses more than just relaying a death. Unless it's a small-knit community, I wouldn't involve the police in the process.
I know a lot of soldiers that would feel disrespected by that. I am not trying to disrespect cops, but they aren't the same as a soldier a pair of soldiers in dress uniforms.
NO! The mail man would be more respectful than the local policeman.
I don't think so Jacey, because the military trains people specifically for this duty. I think having a cop show up at your door with NO information would be so frustrating. At least when the military shows up they have a plan in place, they know what to say, and when to say it.
You are so right Michele. I have been one of those that had to go notify a family of the loss of their love one and it is a very hard job to do, not everyone is able to be a part of that team.
And how to react to the reactions they are going to get when the message be told.
The casualty notification officer's don't have much info to provide the family either. Common sense would say that the police would be provided that limited info too, if they were brought in to be a part of the notification process. The police already do notifications for civilians. Why wouldn't it be appropriate for them to assist the military if asked? The casualty assistance officer would still be military though.
This situation needs to be a lesson for everyone not just those that provide the official notification. It is an embarssment to the command proviiding notification when the surviving spouse receives advance information on the death of a spouse from "non-official" sources.
25 years ago I was invovled in a casualty notification when a Marine was killed in an auto accident while TDY to Ft Sill Oklahoma. The TDY command contacted his father who was a retired Marine Office, who inturn called his daughter-in-law at 4am (PST) on Monther's Day that her husband was dead. We (the command) was not notified of the death until 10am, 6 hours difference. The Commanding Officer and othe individuals notified the wife a hour later. It was embarrassing that the CO was told at the door step of the home that the wife was already notified.
That said, the procedures that we use today are alot better than what were used during Vietnam War and earlier. A telegram via a taxi cab or messenger was delivered. Sometimes the telegram was left on the door step since the spouse or next of kin were not home. There were no assistance on benefits or casualty assistance.
So the father wasn't supposed to notify the daughter in law? That's asking a lot. These days the wife would be notified first as PNOK and the parents next as SNOK. Most times they already know too by the time the CNO get there.
Wow, what a telegram to find on the porch, lol
One reason it remains a military duty is bc after the notification team leaves a second set is sent in shortly after to assist family in details such as meeting the soldiers body at dover afb. There is more than just grief for spouses to deal with, its a very complicated situation and the well trained indviduals that are tasked to do them are the only ones needed.
As a retired Army recruiter, I say let's utilize the resources already in place in the civilian community. That is the respective military recruiter. After all, the military recruiter is a representative of the military branch "imbedded"in the community. There are recruiters, both in city and rural, areas of the US, to include Alaska, Hawaii and US territories. A simple call to each respective recruiting battalion commanding officers will get the ball rolling. Why does it have to be CAO from a major military installation? Time we have seen in this incident, this is a time sensitive issue. What do you all think?
Perhaps I am missing part of this story .. but WHY would anyone other than the notification party be given the names of those killed? My husband was involved in 3 CACO calls one summer .. very painful time. The only people aware of the names were the people assembled to give notification. In one case, the team spent a full day trying to locate the widow .. she was a nurse that worked odd shifts .. had apparently spent the night at a girlfriends house .. they finally were able to locate her and give proper notice. I can say that they did all that they could to give notice in person and without tipping her off. Again, I may be missing part of this tragic story — but it would seem that the identification information needs to be handled with the utmost care. .. hope this never ever happens again! Unforgivable ..
A soldier who was either involved in the incident (as in he was present when it happened) or heard from a 3rd party contacted his wife and told her about it. From there, the word was spread. That's what I'm assuming happened since spouses are blamed for this incident on how she was notified.
Blackouts are SOP. When we lost soldiers, the first thing that got yanked was the NIPRNET and MWR computers and phones. If the FOB had a contracted satellite service, that also got shut down. The problem is the civilian cell phones and small satellite internet nodes that guys buy. The Chain of Command isnt going to shut down an Afghan cell tower (If they could), and those who pitched in and have their own satellite internet also wont be effected. I am not saying cells or these private internet services should be banned, but the NCOs should have made it clear not to reach out back home. I know it happens, especially if it makes the news back home and spouses realize thats their soldiers AOR, but we need to do better in getting the message out to the troops to allow the notification system work.
You are right on with this and I know that our chain of command when I was in Afganistan said that having a cell phone was okay but we had to turn them in for a blackout and they would also pull the plug on the private internet that we had. It is suprising sometimes how quickly word will spread though. In Iraq I was listening in on the radio when the battle roster numbers were read off for those that had been wounded. I was on a computer and if I had wanted to I could have shot a email to my wife that she could look up on the battle roster to see who had been hurt and killed. Self control is a must and is something that has to be pushed by the leadership at all levels of command.
not true we lost three soldiers and the SCO did NOT do a blackout, and this was last year in Afghanistan. Because of that there were a few posting on FB but we were able to catch them in time and have them removed. When the SCO was asked why no blackout his response was the soldiers were big boys and girls and they knew what the could and couldn’t say to their families. The COP that lost the soldiers did have a black out because the 1SG and CPT decided it was best.
Then your SCO was going against all guidance, LOIs and the general orders for the theater in not enforcing a blackout. Should have been relieved.
Iso Quit, Please. Don’t just blame the NCO’s here. ALL soldiers should know better.
Iso Quit, Please. Don’t just blame the NCO’s here. ALL soldiers should know better!
unit members on the battlefield do know most of the time if they have lost their own if they are killed outright. if they are wounded and evacuated, and die later, they may not know. so it is easy to conceive that persons other than the notification team would know.
the military spouse in question may not have told their spouse what was happening because they were close to that buddie and needed to talk about it. I think soldiers do need to share info at times but without details that would break comsec. More education needs to be done with regards to this for both military and military family members.
What I cannot believe about this all is the fact that the last one in the chain of actions chose a TEXT MESSAGE. At that point the damage was done and the news were on Facebook, but really? A text message? This lady didn't have the decency to pick up the phone and CALL? And even if she was scared to call, she could have contacted a chaplain, anyone else.
But yes, the problem starts way higher up in this whole chain. The problem starts with some spouse telling their loved one that something happened, and then that loved one didn't engage the brain and the avalanche was in motion.
Mistakes happen, but I do wish people would remember that the death of a military member is not just a gossip item, it is a life-changing event for all that loved this service member. We as spouses need to remember that yes, sometimes we may hear things we weren't supposed to, or we can add two and two together, but that still doesn't give us the right to pass the knowledge on…
Time to put the soap box up again…
I couldn't agree more. There were times when my husband was able to log on right before a blackout occurred, and all he told me was that I wouldn't hear from him for a couple days but he was fine. He'd log off and that'd be it. People need to learn to have respect for other people. I didn't go running my mouth to other spouses telling them something terrible had to have happened and I didn't even find out why there was a blackout until well after the fact. Military families are smart, for the most part. A smart person wouldn't run their mouth about something that isn't their business until it's made their business. This is why I never made good friends with any of the other spouses in my husband's unit. Drama and gossip aren't my thing. For a while they had even spread rumors about a co-worker and I because he had come over to my house to use my washer and dryer cause his broke. I can see the concern, but he's as good of a friend to my husband as he is me. Military wives disgust me and I can't wait to get away from all this drama.
Petra,
Could not have said it better!
Keep that soapbox out!!!
The worst place for anything to get out is on Facebook. Everyone thinks everything on there is true. I may have one but it's because it's a good way to keep in touch with friends. Cause not all of them have a phone but all of them have a facebook. And Christ I feel grievence for that woman. That is the most disrespectful and unworthy way to recieve the notification of your spouses death. I would like to smack the person who told her. Because it was an utter disgrace. Please let the officials do their jobs. If you do then stupid things woudn't happen and I wouldn't have to question what kind of world that we're living in. Because I would for that to happen if I ever get married. For one day my husband be sittibg there and suddenly his phone buzzes and one of his friends tell him that I'm dead. Again respect and let the officials do there jobs. Thanks.
from what i understood, she didn't text to inform her about her husband. she sent a text to send her condolenses thinking the spouse already knew of her husbands death. maybe she didn't think the widow would feel like talking, but just wanted her to know her thoughts were with her.
My heart breaks for that spouse. Yes, we are smart and know when something is up, but we also know the rules and none of us would want to find out the worst news that way. We as spouses need to take responsibility and not post ANYTHING ANYWHERE until official word has come from Rear D. Yes it is hard not knowing, but not as hard as reading on Facebook that your husband has died.
Well said.
I agree with you, however; I think people should never, ever, post anything at all about someone else's life or regard in their Facebook. I do not care how close you are to that person. And if it is something like a message for that person…it should not be on the status line. Messages are private, unless someone is childish enough to want everyone to read everything.
This is terrible. I am a former FRG (family readiness group leadeer) and we had vast information,, which never leaked out. I had the greatest group of ladies who helped pass on my "no drama, no rumors" ideals.
I never wanted to be the FRG leader for the many reasons people post here, but the truth, is that if run well; it can be a helpfull organization.
As spouses we must be the one who can be quiet and not speculate. it is part of our roles as a spouse and this is lost in today’s silent ranks! I am very disappointed to hear this as I was the day it leaked! I do think that the Army needs serious investigation into who started this whole whirlwind. What spouse knew and who did she tell! I am sure this is already known but her soldier should be in trouble if that is how she learned the information. I don’t care if it was the commanders wife and the FRG leader who let it slip. We know better!
Here was my response on the entire episode! http://hismilitarywife.com/2012/02/as-a-military-spouse-we-should-know-better-despicable/
My heart breaks for that spouse. Yes, we are smart and know when something is up, but we also know the rules and none of us would want to find out the worst news that way. We as spouses need to take responsibility and not post anything anywhere until official word has come from Rear D. Yes it is hard not knowing, but not as hard as reading online that your husband has died.
I do think the local police could be utilized to help make the notification process faster. I lost my father in motorcycle accident. I was the last family member to be notified. The local police sent an officer and a chaplain to
Tell my mother, then my sisters and I in exactly the same process the military does… I know this as two friends lost their husbands over there this year. The civilian notification process to our entire family was complete within four hours of his death. We had his mother notified in person by another police officer and chaplain in another state within two more hours…all in less time than it took for one of my friends to be notified of her husbands death while living on post! The post commander and many higher ups on post knew ALL day… For 15 hours before she did… That her husband had been killed! My entire
Family was notified in person, very respectfully, in exactly the same manner as a military death, within six hours, including those in other states using the local police/chaplain and them coordinating with out of state police…and that was more than ten years ago. In this day of instant communication, despite black outs, it is only common sense
For the military to adapt to the times.
I agree with you. The police officers have some kind of training to give this kind of news as well. They just don't make sure that all of the police officers around the country know before they tell the family. The Army has a lengthy notification process and the family is on the list. News crews often know that an incident occurred (though not the name) before the family even knows. The military has trained civilian crisis teams that are notified sometimes before the family is so they can be ready to assist after notification. The whole unit, command and base know before the spouse. I think the military should either change the order and get the family notification done first and then let everyone else they need to notify know what has happened or use police officers and send the casualty team in afterwards to help with all the tasks that they help with. I understand that the spouse will likely need help dealing with the press and with all the paperwork, but I am sure that that is not what is done within the first several hours anyway.
It would not be possible in most cases as you have to remember not everyone lives in a large city with plenty of police officers around. Some families live where there are six deputies on duty like in Montana. They don't have time to be delivering death notices except their own. And please consider how hard it is to tell someone they loved has died in the first place, to increase that load, as so many soldiers have died in the past 10 years, that's a heck of a burden on police who have enough sadness on their shoulders. Besides, it would have to be an agreement locally with every police department and sheriff's office and the chance of that happening is pretty low. Again, some departments are staffed way too thin to assist.
No. It is not their job to notify families of a military death. The family of that soldier, Marine, Airman, Sailor…. they deserve to respectfully be honored by the organization that their loved one gave their lives serving. It is the responsibility of each branch. It is a rite of honor and respect to give an in-person condolence. This is not the fault of the notification team…. this is the fault of a spouse who couldn't keep her mouth shut. If you are deployed, and you think your spouse back home isn't able to keep OSPEC… than you need to take discretionary caution. If they talk…. it it YOUR fault just as much as it is theirs. The information should be tracked down to who leaked it and that soldier should be reprimanded.
Most local cop shops do not know the military rules or will be able to advise the spouse on what benefits and what support functions are available. Let the military do their job. They are more qualified than the local cops ever will be.
For you Jen, and maybe some others, your state/county police might be trained for this sort of thing. However, having lived all over the country, the sensitivity training of police forces varies from region to region in the United States. I live in a part of the country where to be on the county sheriff team (which is a division of our state police), you just have to be breathing. There is not any special training regarding death notification.
Hence, in this case I do not think that involving police is wise when there is such a varied range of expertise in bereavement training, etc.. I do not want some 300 lb crass officer come up to my door and say "Yo, your son just died" (seen it first hand in our county), so I think leaving this with those that are trained in an ongoing basis is best. It is not perfect but truly, the spouses of those involved in this situation are to blame.
There are so many times when I have been sitting in a coffee shop with some others and I hear some of these spouses talking about very TS information as if it was a sale at Target! First, their husbands never should have divulged it to these gals, and second, these gals should learn to keep their mouths closed.
I remember my grandmother, who was a Navy wife, would have on her refrigerator a little poster the Navy sent to the wives "Remember ladies, Loose lips will sink your husband's ship".
faster response times for notification does need to be implemented. more education in regards to this specifically needs to happen with both military and military family members.
Does it hit anybody else a little bit wrong that the 'official word' on the subject is a finger pointed at 'those darned military spouses." I agree, we should know better, but the leak had to happen on the military side of things for to have made it to whatever civilian tipped this person off. It seems like there is a burden of responsibility there that is being shirked and we're all conveniently the whipping boy. I also wonder if this person who sent the text didn't know that the wife didn't know and perhaps wasn't sending an "I'm so sorry," kind of message. Anyway, it does seem that things need to be re-evaluated.
Whether the original leak came from the military side, it is OUR responsibility as spouses to KEEP OUR MOUTHS SHUT! So what, your spouse calls, upset that his buddy was killed, it is then not YOUR responsibility to then call ANYONE and share. We are the 'whipping boy' because we always seem to be the real issue. And if the person who sent the text, as you think, 'didn't know', is completely false. Had the 'official' message been sent via the FRG, NO, then that person was just as much at fault.
EXACTLY!!! I'm a military spouse and I'm so sick of spouses posting the day / time their spouse will be back from a place (weather it be NTC or deployment). It makes me sick that, like you said, SPOUSES CAN'T KEEP THEIR MOUTH SHUT!
To some the title might be wrong but i think it is right here is why not every soldier feel they can talk to the chain of command or any doctor or any one in the ubiform about certain things so yes some soldiers will tell there spouse be it a husband or wife about stuff they shouldn't but you cant really fault the soldier for it, if the soldier wontt talk to anyone but the spouse and enough events happen now you have a potential high risk soldier on the verge of a break down because they are not talking to someone so now this causes for another possible issue which could lead to suicide, not all soldiers are the same and handle the same issues like others
I'm a military spouse and I do think that it's at least partially the spouses' fault. If I would get information like that from any source other than an official one stating that the spouse has been notified, I'd keep my mouth shut. Maybe I'd call Rear-D, but only maybe.
Yes. Exactly! Could not agree more.
The article may have been harsh with the wording of it being a spouses fault, yes. The soldier would have most likely been the culprit. BUT, we as spouses know better than to go and do something as stupid as that. Okay, rephrase. We as spouses SHOULD know better!!! The soldier should get their butt in trouble for yapping, but the spouse should also face some punishment for pushing the info along. I have been around the military my entire life and it is drilled into your head if you don’t get the info from Rear D or the COC then it is not to be believed…
Maybe the article blaming the spouses will help them wake up and realize their actions have consequences.
I was wondering if the text or fb message said "sorry to hear about your husband" and they didn't realize she didn't know. My husband says there is a blackout with no communication so I'm not sure how they found out.
The blackouts don't include personally owned cell phones. This is usually how leaks occur.
Bad news travels fast. When we found out my husband was getting deployed, I was notified when my mother called me. How did this happen? Phone calls were made that morning. By noon it had blown up on Facebook. The local news had a story about it their website that afternoon. My mother read it and called me in the early evening to "see how I was doing", before my husband had the opportunity to notify me in person after he returned home from work. My notification seems so silly compared to the tragedy of being notified of the death of a spouse in such a callous manner, but it illustrates the point. In this day and age, technology travels faster than etiquette. It's a good reminder, if you hear about a tragedy, give it at least 12-24 hours before reaching out to those effected via Facebook, texting, phone calls, etc. I'm sure the party who made the dumb mistake said something like, "OMG I just heard the news, how are you doing?!?" Completely unintentional but absolutely brainless.
"but absolutely brainless"
^^There's the key phrase right there!! People need to learn that they need to THINK BEFORE THEY SPEAK! As a spouse we know not to run our mouths about confidential information, but some people still can't get the concept!
utterly thoughtless and heartless, did that person ever thought, this is not the way I would want my family to find out and just dont do it…people can be so insensitive.. Think before you do things people…damn!…My heart goes out to that family..May his soul rest in peace and I do thank him for his services…<3
The military personnel need to shut their damn pie holes. If the spouses don't know before hand then they can't be stupid and put the info out there like that.
To some the title might be wrong but i think it is right here is why not every soldier feel they can talk to the chain of command or any doctor or any one in the ubiform about certain things so yes some soldiers will tell there spouse be it a husband or wife about stuff they shouldn't but you cant really fault the soldier for it, if the soldier wontt talk to anyone but the spouse and enough events happen now you have a potential high risk soldier on the verge of a break down because they are not talking to someone so now this causes for another possible issue which could lead to suicide, not all soldiers are the same and handle the same issues like others this is not the militarys fault in any way shape or form
SPOUSES KNOW not to keep the information rolling out of their mouth! Spouses need to stop getting defensive and just take some notes!!
Wow.
What kind of callous person would text something like that?? Did they have to be the first person in line to tell the bad news? It was on Facebook too?
Even if the spouse who is deployed tells their spouse back in the states that one of their brothers/sisters was KIA a smidge of common sense should prevail in keeping it to themselves.
Shame on whoever did this. I hope that the favor's never returned.
Couth.
It's pretty easy to spell & not very hard to practice.
this what happens when the command share info with other spouses back home, trust i have seen it, too much gossip and when news like this happens, the only personnel that can call home during a time like that are the command group which are the higher ranking, at least when i was In Iraq they have their own cell phones and were able to receive calls from the rear
When my husband was deployed it was the men posting dates and other Opsec violations not only the spouses.
I think that the Army needs to find out who told the wives that then passed on the information. Soldiers deployed should know better than to give out names during the first 24 hours to insure that the casualty notification team has been able to do their job. The problem is that many soldiers have cell phones or go on mission to a base not on black out and they are then able to call home. The spouse at home may ask about what is going on and the service member should just say "hey, you know it isn't me. I'll tell you more in a few days." That would easily prevent this because with out taking away the rights to cell phones and blacking out the entire country there is no way to keep the information in theatre.
absolutely! the military member can call to say Im safe – and even if they feel the need to say – we lost some – spare your spouse the details – and stick to how you feel about it to get it off your chest. These soldiers grieve when they lose their own – and sharing the feelings and thoughts about that grief is important but they need to do so without giving out the names until they are certain he families of those friends they lost have had time to be notified. as both a military member and a military spouse – I understand the need for com blackout – i can see on the news that people have died where my husband is stationed and the most i have ever asked was – "is it someone in the unit?" just so I can be ready to help once the information has been shared through proper channels. I do not want to be the person giving the information for the first time. It is done by a team for a reason. To ensure there are qualified people in place to provide emotional support as well as the other supports.
I don't think it's even a good idea to say "we lost some". Considering that unit families become close, that is enough to put spouses in a tailspin. During my husband's last deployment I received a frantic call from a fellow spouse. She had received an email from her husband stating "we lost one today". She was so upset by the thought that someone from the unit was harmed and was calling to find someone to confirm her fears. I didn't confirm or deny, but did remind her that we would be notified via official channels if something did happen. I also pointed out that to a Marine, any Marine from any unit who has been killed is considered a personal loss to each Marine out there and this loss may not have been someone from our husbands' unit. I did talk to my husband later that night and told him about my conversation with the spouse and he did in fact have a talk with her husband about his inappropriate comment on his email and the resulting panic it caused for his wife and any other spouses she may have talked to about this. Comments like these cause more harm than good and it's best to refrain from saying anything until official notifications have been made.
This is so sad.. I can't even imagine. The information leaks multiple ways.. and the blame shouldn't be solely on the Army spouses that accidentally consoled Mrs. Born before she'd been properly notified in person by the CNOs. The information simply has to come from downrange for the spouses at home to know – so if there is a problem, the problem lies with the soldiers downrange confiding in their loved ones about a loss in the unit FAR too soon. Sometimes the notification process takes a bit longer, do to inaccurate information on the family member at home, the family member being away from home, etc. The soldiers downrange *must* remain quiet and respectful of their lost comrade by *NOT* sharing the information with their loved ones until word has reached them downrange that ALL family members of the fallen have been notified. Yes.. it's easier said than done. However, it's a human life we're talking about here. That person lived, served, and died for their country.. is it too much to ask to keep sensitive information to yourself until you know for damn sure that your buddy's wife and parents have been notified first? Sorry, I don't blame the spouses at home. I blame the soldiers, who know better, and were the direct cause of this happening. Obviously, they're under investigation, and in big big trouble.. This is very sad news.. my heart is heavy with the pain Mrs. Born experienced in the passing of her husband, and the way in which she learned of his passing. He will never be forgotten, and may he rest in peace. May she find peace in his life and passing.
I understand the whole black out polices we had to go through it here, but what some fail to see is the fact of brother hood and family. Over the course of soldier’s time at a duty station, the meet other soldiers families and form a family like bond with them, and yes the army is one big family maybe not a happy one but we are all a family non the less. I know that many wives in or unit have asked soldiers close to the loved ones be the one to tell them the bad news, since they rather not have some random man in a uniform that knows nothing about them tell them the news. I believe that the spouses and soldiers should have a right to choose in which the information is given in the case that the soldier gets killed in combat. I think the men or women in the platoons and fire teams let the spouses know the basic details and then have a team tell them the rest. I would want one of my fellow NCO’s or one of my soldiers tell my family because they know me better then some random chaplin. Those are my thoughts
Brian,
What you are saying is vastly different than your family finding out on Facebook or by text message!
I agree, having been the receiver of this kind of information. The initial notification is urgent and requires a very proven protocol by the CACO and that required training is essential. In our case, my Mother saw the two coming to the front door. She knew what it meant and before they knocked, she asked "which one?" as all three of us were in Vietnam. It was my youngest brother who left a 3-month old son who never saw his father. I was on my ship in port in Japan, my wife was called by my father who called my CO, who notified me as I was on another ship. My brother's wife was notified at the same time as my family. In our case, the CACO fell apart and was a basket case but the second phase, post-notification is where another set of protocols are put into action. On Thanksgiving Day, my other brother and I viewed his remains at Dover AFB, before taking him home, probably the saddest day in my life. Every thing was done, for example, I arrived at McGuire AFB and when to find transportation to Dover, the USAF just "found" a C-141 to fly me a few miles to Dover when they read my escort orders.
Oh, if we'd been initially notified by "texting" and not by that young man and chaplain coming to our family front door, we'd really have been disappointed, as a military family, my Mom knew exactly what the CACO would do before he knocked on the door. Any other way would have been irregular and not what we would have expected.
It was on my return, now to my ship in the Gulf of Tonkin, that I met a soldier who was with my brother when he died and found out details that should not have been told to us before his Arlington burial. I then wrote his widow and my family those horrific details. My Mother is now buried with him in Arlington (his widow released her burial spot for her).
One never forgets how they are notified of a casualty, thus doing this critical event properly is absolutely essential.
Brian,
While I understand your sentiments, you also have to think about impact. If a fellow Soldier tells a spouse that her husband is dead, that places another burden on the wife. She will associate that news with the unit and/or the person explaining. That's not fair. She will need those people in other capacities. By having a group of individuals there who are not familiar with the deceased personally give the news, it allows someone else to be the bearer of bad news and also promotes a foundation for the spouse to utilize fellow servicemembers and their wives in more positive ways. Additionally, that group is trained on how to relay that information respectfully, as well as deal with the emotional backlash. It also wound not be fair to a comrade telling a spouse the news. There is a very real possibility that she will lash out and ask things like, "Where were you?" or "Why couldn't you save him?" Its not an easy thing on any level, but I feel that it is wholeheartedly better for there to be separation between the deceased and the news-carrier.
Brian you know that I absolutely agree with you. This would help build efficiency in the notification process while eliminating the potential for leaks from complete strangers or their wives. I want to know from a friend if something happens to my husband. The last thing I want is a total stranger showing up at my door delivering this news. Yes this is not the best method for everyone but should be allowed for those who ask specifically for such method. I realize that there are people that handle grief through blame but in a case like mine I would know his friend was not to blame nor could prevent it. My husband is a warrior and if he were to die young he would want to die a hero so who would I be to say otherwise and dishonor him or his friend with blame. Everyone has different opinions but a stranger giving me bad news would likely catch rage from me where as I would handle the news differently from a familiar face especially being more than 20 hours from any family. As far as I am concerned these guys he is there with are family and should be treated as such even in bad times.
FRG's are brought in when the blackout goes in place (in some units) which means the CMD Team is authorized to brief in the FRG leadership so that they can develop a plan to assist the spouse. To assume that the Soldier's down range had no authorization to release the information is absurd- potentially they did, and in that scenario it still rests with the big mouth of someone NOT down range, i.e. a spouse. Even during "blackout" or being "up river city" there are computers that still have access to the internet for official purposes that do not get blocked during blackout. Usually MWR and commonly accessed computers get blocked. Even when a SM slips information out- lets say for instance it was because I was finding difficulty in dealing with a situation and needed the counsel of a spouse, there is still personal responsibility on the part of the spouse not to let it get any further. Most spouses think that just because their SM gave them information they have the authority to run off and spew the information wherever they please with no consequences.
No, the command is not authorized to tell anyone else that there has been a casualty before the NOK has been notified. Not even to prep the CARE Team. Unit's disregard this all the time though. Actually, during the training I attended in Germany, the rear-d is not supposed to be notified before Army HQ and the official process has been started.
This story makes me so sad. Everyone is wondering "how the info could have gotten out?" It is very simple. If this Soldier was in the same unit, then his entire unit knew what happened to him. On my husbands last two deployments, he had a cell phone, as did most of his Company. When these "blackouts" occur, they do not take away cell phones. They are supposed too, but they do not. Soldier's downrange are still calling out on cellphones. So someone that worked with this Soldier, knew what happened, probably called his wife, and told her, possibly even trusted her to not say anything, and there began the snowball effect. I took the Casualty Asst. training (at Ft. Stewart ) I know how the process works and they will NOT show up at your door in the middle of the night. They will only notify between 7:00 a.m. and 10:00 p.m. So that sometimes, causes an issue with gaps in time. They put a lot of effort into making sure this process is handled right. Unfortunately, it doesn't always happen that way. I hope that the spouse of the Soldier that was killed can find peace and heal from this. My thoughts and prayers are with her and her family. May the Soldier that was killed Rest in Peace.
Very well said! Just to add to this a little, on my husband’s last deployment I received a lot of information that through common sense I knew not to say anything to anyone about. NONE of that information I received was from my husband. He never even mentioned it until after he was home, we had gone through reintegration, and I told him I knew about it. He knew not to pass the info when it happened so he didn’t; someone else told me & I had the sense to keep it to myself. I also want to add that we can’t always know details immediately about things that happen & the military needs time to father the information to give answers to questions that will no doubt be asked like, “how?” I do not know a single military family that just wants to be told that their solder is gone, but have no other answers or information given to them. May that soldier’s family find strength to deal with this tragedy & the soldier Rest in Peace.
It's time for jail-time for those who break protocol. My husband has been in five year-long deployments in the last 10 years. Every single deployment I hear about spouses pulling this crap. Being on the inside, I've noticed that spouses (and I am one) seem to love to gossip and enjoy having the juciest bit of gossip. I work so I don't have time for gossip and don't have spouses on my FB. Thankfully.
You break protocol like this because you want to have the juciest gossip, you need to go to jail. I'm sure no one agrees with me, but I could not care less if you do. Grieving spouses deserve the correct protocol and respect. Shame on you for being involved in this and you should go straight to jail.
I agree with you 100%, i've seen the same exact thing and it disgust me. I have been given the cold shoulder because i don't care to gossip. But i agree with the whole jail time.
I agree. I have been in the same location for over a year and still do not have friends here because the choice of many is to get together and gossip. I do not have time for that nor do I care to do it. I’m not saying all spouses, but a lot of them do get together to do this. As a military spouse I would never want to hear through gossip, text, fb, twitter or any other social network any serious news.
What I read on Facebook about this story, is that a rear d commander published an official letter on the units page. Rear d THOUGHT the wife was already notified. When hearing that she hadn’t been notified yet, they took it off Facebook, but the damage had been done. Spouses talked about it. This is why someone wrote a text (very un-personal in my eyes!!), because they thought it was official. What strikes me as odd though, is why did rear d post something like this “official” letter within a couple of hours of this SGT’s death?!?!? I would never want to find out this way. Problem is, my FIL was a very high rank in the army, I just hope I get the news officially and not a call from him or a Facebook status update by the MIL…
Why would Rear D CO even tell anyone but the people who were going to her house?? Let alone tell the rest of the soldiers they would find out in due time when they needed to know
It strikes me as odd that Facebook is playing such a huge role with how we as families communicate with army units. I'm all for getting information in a timely manner, however, When is too much information? There should be some rules when posting anything on facebook as far as I'm concerned. When I started the Army life five years ago I was told that it's a no no to ride around town with a bumper sticker showing your unit pride, because if your husband is deployed it makes you an easy target. Why then are units posting sensitive information on facebook pages that are open to the public? I really enjoy getting updates about events on post though facebook, and use it for that purpose. But when is it crossing the line for deployed soldiers or rear D commanders to post pictures and messages to the public about the ongoing activies and lives, or in the case death of members of the unit?
I blame the Army, not social media, nor the spouses. Having worked Casualty Assistance 2002-05 (10 Mountain Fort Drum) and down-range (Desert Storm 24 Infantry Fort Stewart), I have an opinion. Before the storm I completed a Masters Degree in third generation computer language. My undergraduate after VN was second generation. You guys are like 11 generation computer technolgy.
My primary MOS is armor crewman (1971-2005). Two events stand out. Desert Storm. There was no personal computers. AT&T set up a phone station and we shut it down. Fast forward to GWOT. We were notified immediately what the action was down-range, via automation. A team of two was dispatched, one officer, one Soldier.
I loathe to count myself amongst Army wives because they are such stupid, gossiping twits.
The government wanted to keep this event compartmentalized, because of the burning of the Korans. The prisoners were writing notes to each other in them.
Are you even with us???
I’ve been in the Army for 11 years and there’s an old saying “if you want to know what’s going on in your unit, just ask the FRG–they know everything before you do!” However, this story is just mortifying. What kind of person would send a spouse a text about that? That’s a character flaw. My heart goes out to Mrs. Born.
I learned of this death on Facebook through the Ft Stewart military postings. There was a news update that posted. I paid particular attention because my son in law's first name is Joshua.
Hi Cheryl, as an army wife that will be stationed at Ft. Stewart at sometime in the future, I have been keeping up with the units there and I'm a little concerned about the amount of information that they are putting on there open facebook pages. I'm just wandering if over using the Army facebook pages is too blame for this incident?? Is this the main source of information for families at Fort Stewart?
This s a major issue that needs to be addressed and handled with a firm hand, one thing that might help is quit holding the soldiers responsible for what their spouses do, make the spouse accountible for what they do not the soldier. Then lets look in to using some of the recruiting station in the United States as Notification Teams I realize that there is suppose to be an Officer that is involved but why does it have to be all recruiting stations have a SFC in charge Officer or not the notification can still be done and can be done alot faster that way with the respect and dignity that the Fallen Soldier and Family Members deserve and earned. No matter what there will always be a rumor mill that will probably never change because the people need to change for that to stop. If a spouse does find out they need to ask them selves how would they like to find out before they say somthing, I was a Rear-Detachment First Sergeant and had the privvilage of having a great FRG and Leader that was awesome and the rumor mill was always to a minimum, it also helped that the spouses would call me directly when there was a possible issue which gave me and my Commander time to react and stop it before anything escalated to the point of no return.
Put simply this wasnt just the wives fault we can blame them all we want but fact is that the real people to blame are the soldiers. We as soldiers should not tell a soul about the death of another soldier until after the next of kin has been notified. Black outs happen for a reason and this instance failed it by far. OPSEC is the job of the soldier as well as the spouses.
Jimmy,
Love you, but the spouse would not have opened their stupid mouth without getting the info from somewhere. Last time I checked the soldier was down range…
Both to blame
If God forbid I am ever delivered the news of my husband’s death it better be by the damn uniformed officer that I’m expecting. Yes I’m smart enough to know that if my husband tells me he is going to call me at a certain time and doesn’t it’s more than likely a black out. I might add that, yes I spent that entire time waiting by the phone like my life depended on it, and watching the news. I dont ask questions like “Who died?, What happened? Was anyone injured”, and even if I did I would never tell anyone the information my husband passed to me. I can’t speak for all army wives only myself, but I for one am fine with that. I would never take away an Army Wife‘s right to hear the news of her husband’s death with dignity, just so I could be the first one to right a post on Facebook. But just because I wouldn’t doesn’t mean that there are not wives out there that would jump on the chance. Having said all of that, I'm sure if I were actually the one receiving such overwhelming news I would not care about the process of which I was told, but that I was told at all.
Put simply your husband should never tell you any information on who has been killed or anything that happens. OPSEC is something we must all keep in mind when talking to loved ones back home. Yes it sucks i can't tell my wife about anything i do in my job or what happens but she as a military spouse understands and accepts that i cant give that information to her
Or perhaps the military needs to go back to old school and only allow two people phone and internet (Commanders and First Sergeants) the rest have to do it old fashioned write a letter, then we know where the problem lies on the shoulders of from that point on.
The military has mission essential needs on the internet. Not to mention the soldiers that take classes while we are in theater. My job specifically relies on the internet for resources i need to learn and to problem solve as well as information about certain software.
this is not just to Jusika, but to everybody who is saying that the active duty military must have leaked it first. Probably… Then again, it might have been a new private telling friends back home, or posting on FB since everybody seems to have to say "anything and everything" on FB (their 15 minutes of fame). It may have been one of the contracted civilians working over there, that had first hand info (and had to post it on FB for their 15 minutes). Everybody has to blab! We revel in the feeling of "saying it first". We have to be involved with the sensationalism. Bottom line, if you hear about someone else's tragedy, husband, wife, friend, bite yer tongue. Zip your lip. Ensure the proper notification has been made. Maybe use a little common sense, something people seem to be short on lately. Oh, and all that so called "information blackout", with all the computers and cellphones, it's just "misinformation". There's no such thing as a blackout, people will go out of their way to BLAB …
I hear you with keeping a lid on it, but telephone communication is shut down in most of the units I have worked with. Maybe yours were different.
I hear you with keeping a lid on it, but telephone communication is shut down in most of the units I have worked with. Maybe yours was
different.
You know this add make the reputation of nosey spouses true…. I'm in the military and one time is too many for something of a sensitive nature like this to keep happening. Some spouses have no sense of maturity, sympathy or respect for the privacy of other people period. This text did not have to happen, that spouse had a choice and she decided to be disrespectful to the family by doing such a thing. What could you be thinking? " Oh, I wonder if ???? knows if her husband was killed earlier today, let me send her a text and find out". Really…. The Army as such other branches of service have a protocol to follow, respect that. It doesn't matter if your husband or wife calls and tell you what happened, what was told to you should not leave your lips ever. MIND YOUR BUSINESS PLEASE… because you don't know how love ones will react to the news you are giving them.
:( This is very sad my thoughts and prayer's go out to this family….
this has got to be the saddest thing ive heard. my heart goes out to the family that lost their husband,father son and friend. may God bless u with strength and wrap each of u in His love. the way the news was given may of been wrong but they still lost a loved one. we each as Americans need to continue to pray for our troops as well as their families because even though they dont stand on the battle field they are still in the battle.
I knew Sgt Born. Went to A.I.T. with him. Can not believe how Awful those Army wives are. They should be ashamed! And should have thought of her instead of just putting it out there.
This should solely fall on the Active Duty Member?!? How so?! The spouse that informed the woman should BE AS MUCH AT FAULT, considering she opened her mouth (via text / facebook) which had NOTHING TO DO WITH HER! As I said in a previous post I'm also a military spouse, BUT I'm not butt-hurt because they're blaming spouses. I've seen WAY TOO MANY spouses blurting stuff all over facebook, to their friends, etc that shouldn't leave their home! If you get defensive over the title of the article then you people must be some of the ones that run your mouth. Our spouses and service members along with them can be put at risk by things people post on facebook and/or blab to their friends.
If the soldiers didn't leak it out to their spouses then this sort of thing would not happen!
When my husband was over in Iraq in 2003, one of the spouses let me know that her husband told her even when they were on "communication blackout" that they had lost one of the men. I did not call and tell anyone. I didn't want to believe it until I heard officially.
So sorry she has lost her husband.
I am very sadden by how this wife was notified! I agree that if your soldier confides in you don’t go blabbing your mouth to have the juiciest gossip. I am very proud to be a Army wife and I would NEVER do this to another wife whether I knew them or not! This is wife I don’t associate myself with the FRG or very many spouses!
The shame is on the spouse that didn’t wait for notification process to be finalized.
However, this is the second time a major event has occurred regarding Ft. Stewart, in which not enough time had passed for a thorough investigation of an incident to occur, and Ft. Stewart rushes out a statement condemning Army wives (spouses).
Ft. Stewart is starting to come of as mysogynistic at best, and the example of very poor leadership from which down range is a party to, at worst.
In no way am I condoning this “bearer of bad news” behavior, but Ft. Stewart’s message is just as premature and wrong.
Think before you post, BE a part of the solution and not a continuation of the problem. If the spouses do not feel supported, they will NOT use your services on post and get the valuable information that YOU need them to have to make your next OER shine. Yes, it is just as simple as common courtesy. This texting spouse should have used it, and Ft. Stewart command should do so as well.
It is sad that there are those that simply love trying to get ahead of the Army hand it’s mission. If there really wanted to track down the individual responsible for this they found but probably won’t. This breach in procedures will be addressed by more truing for those doing the right thing! The guilty are really held accountable.
Having gone through this 44 years ago there is still no easy way to do this. I was stationed in West Germany at the time. My First Sgt came out in our morning formation and told me to report to the Red Cross in the next town. I will never forget being handed the telegram saying that my older Brother had passed away from wounds he had sustained in Vietnam. To find out this way is unacceptable, having served for over 21 years in sensitive positions I find it should not go unpunished.
One need only to watch “We Were Soldiers” to know that the “dark sedan” and “the knock” is the only proper way to inform someone that their soldier is dead. I suspect there will be a few Article 15s handed out to those who found a way around the blackout. After all, this is exactly why they exist.
This would be a moot point if the horrific beurocracy of casualty notification was rectified and if DA didnt hold overall control over when notification happens. As a rear-d commander we would have to wait for up to 3 days for injury notification and 18-20 hours to kick out death notifications. All because the chain for notification is utterly beurocratic and has to travel through a ridiculous maze of commands before the rd can even react. Aside from that soldiers stupidly post things they shouldnt online or tell their 18 year old spouses and expect their immature mind to keep it silent.
It sounds like some soldiers knew, that were deployed… told their spouse and the spouse spread the word. In my opinion that shouldn't be a gossip thing to do. Most military spouse tend to go that route. I have seen it myself as a military spouse. There were countless of time that i simply said, if it has nothing to do with you then i don't care to hear is because it has nothing to do with me. A lot of them gave me the cold shoulder for holding my ground when it comes to privacy. People need to learn that this is a very delicate situation, if you are not the proper messenger than you should keep your mouth shut. And wait till the family has received the news themselves. Just like any of you would love your family's privacy when bad news comes your way. And posting it on Facebook, that is absolutely disrespectful and a mockery. When my husband deployed the first time over seas, he told me… "If anything is to happen to me while I'm over there, You will have news delivered to you in person" He explained the whole thing to me and he also told me… "Do not go by what someone may tell you, or write you or anything… if it turns out to be true, you wait and see… Some people will do this out of malice." Thankfully he came back home to me twice… and I'm very grateful. But people should learn not to meddle in peoples lives. Out of respect.
I hope the wives with the big mouths that delivered this awful news in such tactless manner feel like the complete and utter asses that they are!
Actually both the military member and their spouse should be punished for the leak.
A very, very sad story we had here at Fort Stewart, and one that could have, and should have, been prevented. The CAO team was on their way to Mrs. Born's home, which can take some time (you never know how far the team had to travel), and, sadly, she found out beforehand. As for being confirmed on the phone – the Maj in charge did what he had to – he couldn't "deflect" her question or lie; in the end, that would have been far worse. I hope is a lesson to people – think before you speak (Soldiers and spouses in this case); do not assume anyone knows anything and give things TIME (I know that's difficult in this age of instant gratification).
communication blackout for death of a soldier is mandatory. However it is not instantanious. The Serious Incident Report goes up according to established time standards and confirmation is requested and received. The black out might take effect up to 3 hours AFTER the initial notification TO THE AUTHORITY THAT HAS THE ABILITY TO ORDER THE BLACKOUT. There are levels to the military called the chain of command. Without JAMMING you cannot cut personal communication devices anyway unless the military is in active control of cell phone towers, personal internet access, and satphones.
In conclusion, since I had this happen in one of my companies in 2004 when a soldier was KIA, the notification team arrived at the home of the soldiers mother to a full blown wake. the soldiers "friends" decided to contact the mother and let her know her son was gone by telephone. You want to blame someone, look in the mirror. There will always be a constant tradeoff between security and open communication. Take away the phones, take away the computers, and only allow the solders a Family Message Form and Red Cross and these issues will go away.
Ok. People are deffinately getting on my nerves here saying that they are upset because the blame is getting put on the spouses.. haha. Wow. Army spouse finds out of her husband's death in a combat zone via text. That's what it says. Who's fault is it that she got a TEXT instead of a phone call or someone in person?? The spouse who was disrespectful enough and didnt have the courage to tell her any other way. That's why the blame is going on the spouse that told her. Besides, it is directed to that individual that actually did it. So if it wasnt you, then you shouldn't be getting offended.
I don't know what happened but I don't think it was an official notification via text like the commentors are suggesting. Probably a concerned spouse texted her friend to offer condolences. An innocent text to say "I'm so sorry your husband was killed". I can only imagine now how the textor wife must feel.
What I do know is that communications blackouts are no longer effective. Soldiers have computers and internet connections in their room. I've heard other spouses say "oh, my soldier skyped me during the blackout to let me know he's safe". The finger pointing of blame goes all around: soldiers down range and their spouses.
After serving in the military for 21 years to include Iraq and Afghanistan, what I will say is that this was wrong on so many levels…from the leak in Afgh to someone in the US to Mrs. Born and Joshuas family. They will not given the respect, support, and dignity that they deserved and allowed to start their grieving for their loss in private. For what it is worth Mrs. Born, I am so sorry for these idiots and I am very sorry for your loss. God Bless you and your family.
Although we dont know what the text message said i would think it was more of a condolence message. If one person had it on facebook and another was able to text those spouses may have thought that it had become general knowledge and wanted to be supportive
I know the emotions of spouces/families etc, of deployed military. I have been in the position of FRG and there was an accident including injuries and a death. Myself and another wife were on the recieving end of the phone call of the family asking the question of "why didnt you contact me and tell me, Why hasnt the army contacted me and tell me". It is an awful posission to be in. Especially when I knew no details. It happens It is sad and It is human. I didnt take the phone call lightly, and I didnt go threw chain of command I went straight to the top. Directly to the Major asking the same questions. As FRG we are not to deliver these types of messages, Why is this family confronting my and a co wife over things you should have informed them.
You must understand the information came from the burn unit at Bethesda. The soldier was there the hospital was contacting the family.
But why didnt the military, what took so long? Yes I was angry and emotional myself. Its tramatic!
Well needless to say, the situation was rectified and the Major went overseas to check on the situation. That burnt up soldier was taken care of and is alive today :) By the grace of God.
Stuff happens we are all only human.
I am very sorry for the loss of yet another one of our brave military souls who gave all he had to give. To the family, the loss is deep but allow the pride to over come. God Bless you all
Yes, the spouses who forwarded the info were/are stupid. However, the military personnel who shared confidential info with their spouses were even MORE stupid and should be standing tall before the man.
I heard of the passing of one of my husbands best friends and battle buddy. Someone down range had been on messenger and told some mutual friends of ours. At 5 am I had a friend banging on our door, (my husband had just switched brigades and was not deployed) and this friend was telling us all about our friends death. I waited until I seen an official notification to his next of kin before I called anyone!! We as wives need to respect that there is a process and until there is an official notification made we have to keep that info to ourselves. I can't imagine how horrible I would have felt if I had called his dad and he hadn't been notified yet. Our guys are going to relay info to us that we shouldn't talk about, that's a given. We need to know when to hold our tongue!!
Speculating that something has happened because all the hubbies from a unit haven't called in is one thing, can't do anything about that. But that doesn't tell them WHO was killed. For them to know the NAME of the soldier killed means some dumb*** downrange called his wife when he wasn't supposed to, or someone in RD ran their mouth to one of the spouses — either being at least a breach of military protocol, and I'm pretty sure calling when there is a communications blackout would be disobeying a direct order.
When there was a screw up with our last unit with who know what when and how, it was because there was a failure by our chain of command all the way up to brigade level to hold a pre-deployment briefing for the families that should have included proper procedure, protocol, and expectations of the causualty notification process and assistance. And when done properly, the preson from CAO would have told the spouses to try to not be passing along information about certain things until they are put out publicly to the group by the Rear Detachment. This is a lesson that should have been learned long before now in 10 years of combat. It should be going on every time with every unit because you will always have new soldiers and spouses for whom it is there first deployment and you always have the boneheads that need reminding every time.
The real problem here is that it’s become socially acceptable to offer codolences via text message or social media. We had a Soldier pass away in Korea, and her family found out before being officially notified because of all the “R.I.P.” messages posted on the Soldier’s facebook within an hour of her death.
Part of the reason for the delay of this spouse being notified is because she was not on or near the base where her husband's unit was stationed. She had moved back to Illinois to stay with her family. It is possible that her husband and/or she did not tell the unit. But even if they did, I'm from that region and Olive Branch is a tiny spot in the road out in the boonies near the Ohio River. They would have had to have either had someone sent from Ft. Campbell or Scott AFB which are both 3 hours away from her or notified one of the National Guard units to get a team together to send to her, which by the time they get ahold of the NG unit and they get ahold of their people who are part of the team could still take 3 hours and then have to drive there. The nearest National Guard unit to her would be over an hour's drive away southeast in Cairo, and that's provided that unit isn't deployed. If that were the case, they could have to have someone come from the Reserve unit all the way up at Marion, which is more than an hour north. And time limit is provided they don't get lost, its hairy out there in those hills if you don't live there.
@KATE…that’s right! It’s the spouses fault for having moved from the duty station. *** is wrong with you?
This is sad and unforgivable, it is also black and white. It is the responsibility of the active duty member to comply with their OPSEC rules and not to share information with their wives no matter how much they love or trust them, until it is safe for the information to be shared (whether it be a casualty or a flight time change). If the active duty member didn’t share the news with their spouse, then the spouse wouldn’t have to assume anything. She wouldn’t have to make a judgement call. She would have nothing to share, just as it should be.
In addition, I realize there are times when military spouses do come into information accidentally or because they have received an unexpected phone call, etc. It is at this time, when common sense and safety for your spouse and his/her soldiers and their families, can be put in your hands. Do the right thing. Think. Double check. Don’t post, “my husband’s flight got pushed back to 2pm”, just go pick him up and post about it when he’s home safe and sound!
My heart breaks for this family. Unnecessary crap on top of a tragedy.
Shame on these spouses, the ‘offical’ who confirmed the death over the phone and the active duty member who leaked this information out first. The information we receive about deployments is a PRIVLEDGE not an ENTITLEMENT!!! OPSEC is reiterated over and over and there is no excuse!
I realize that things are different now; but a good illustration is seen in We Were Soldiers.
One of the things that might be done is to eliminate cell phones and laptops from combat zones like the British do.
This happened because of a vengeful wife who did not like another wife, it also happened because a husband came home and told his wife information which should not have been released. She thought she would get "back" at this young woman by doing this. My own feelings are the soldier should be seriously disciplined and charges should be brought by the vengeful hateful person that decided to take it upon herself to do this. My thoughts and prayers are with this young woman and her family.
I'm confused about how Ft. Stewart can blame the spouses here. The article says the unit was supposed to be in communications blackout so how did the other spouses in the unit find out in the first place!?!? Shouldn't the blame be on the soldiers who are trained and should know better who leaked the information and not the spouses?
Why is the author blaming the Army notification process?
It started with a Soldier who mentioned it to his spouse and it snowballed from there. My husband's deployed three times. Yes, there was usually a schedule to his calls, but not always. And while there may be times you learn of information before the rest of the group, it's *not* your job to be the messenger. At every deployment briefing I've gone to, I've heard the same thing over and over again. Don't spread rumors. Call the FRG leader if you have questions. Remember OPSEC is everyone's responsibility. Don't believe everything you hear. Unfortunately, I know too many spouses who don't think any of this applies to them.
The Army may move slowly at times, but it does so with good reason. Shame on that spouse. Shame on the Soldier who blabbed. Denying the spouse a moment to privately grieve should haunt you for the rest of your lives.
And nice job, Bigmouth Spouse. A text? You didn't even have the decency
The army needs tell all families let them do their job and my heart is with poor woman got word in way that just not right.
OMG I can not believe this woman told this lady her husband had died in action over a text message…how classy, and sympathetic (sarcasm) What in the hell was she thinking? Was this revenge on the woman I mean my Lord how absolutely trashy! She should not have told her at all she should have let the military or the person who was named to tell her actually do their duty! I am so angered by this EWWW!!!
I think that in order to see that this doesn't happen, all military personell should designate two people close to both their spouse and parents to be notified emmidiately by phone in the event of their death. Ideally these people would be able to physically go to their homes to notify them of the loss. But, even a phone call from a loved one is better than getting it by txt or worse, reading it on Facebook. The military should still make a call to the spouse/partents house to offer their condolences ASAP. My heart goes out to this young woman, atleast she was with her family when she received the txt and not by herself.
I found out Thursday morning that two of our men had died via army times website…I’m an army wife with my husband stationed at Fort Stewart as well and he has also been deployed. I was in disbelief that they had already posted it with it being so recent. My deepest sympathy goes out to the families of our fallen soldiers and how they found out.
Oo
I am completely disgusted by this! It astounds me that a spouse or group of spouses decided to post an update/text message this poor wife that her husband was KIA! I am an Air Force wife. Let me tell you, if someone other than my husband’s Commander or Chief Engineer were to text me or post something on FB about the death of my husband. Heads would be rolling. You would find me on their doorstep beating asses. I think this is despicable beyond belief. And trust me, my in-laws and my own parents would be right there with me. Absolutely disgusting!!
I am completely disgusted by this! It astounds me that a spouse or group of spouses decided to post an update/text message this poor wife that her husband was KIA! I am an Air Force wife. Let me tell you, if someone other than my husband’s Commander or Chief Engineer were to text me or post something on FB about the death of my husband. Heads would be rolling. You would find me on their doorstep beating butts. I think this is despicable beyond belief. And trust me, my in-laws and my own parents would be right there with me. Absolutely disgusting!!
It is what it is, the armed forces has not had to deal with this in the way that this is coming about, during WWII it took how long for the word to come to their families who did not receive a letter when they were supposed to, it is another media they will have to deal with, the death however tragic needs to get to the families as fast as possible to let the healing start, this is another although quick way, I think it is more of a noble situation to be told in person by the military, noting how they used to drive up in a military vehicle and the family member knowing in an instant, that is more to me a just and fitting way. Not by western union telegram as was used during WWII also. the point is who knows the best way. Just tell them and let them get to the healing process.
My heart goes out to the Spouse of the soldier killed and his family. And as upsetting as this may be. I don't think this was done maliciously. I believe the person was either unaware that notification had not been made or was trying to help. As far as the text, well that part I don't understand. God Bless
" Proud ARMY wife 7 yrs".
Bottom line, some one an idiot leaked the news and it spread like cancer. This seems toi be the age of techno-ignorance. They spread the word before a briefed and prepared CAMO team could show up. Ft Stewart was not going to answer questions over the phone from anyone till notification- that's what the book says. The CAMO are the ones with the answers on hand and a chaplain to help console and plan the details of the butial. Just where the blazes was her support from the texters/tweeters?? Where they there to hold her hand, hand her klenex, help make the necessary arrangement? HELL NO. May they should have keot heir mouths and fingers quiet till she had been told and had support on hand.
Megan was stationed here at Stewart and it broke my heart how she found out. Some of these spouses talk way too much and don't know how to show others respect. People were all over her facebook page leaving their condolences and the poor girl had no idea why. My husband was on funeral detail and we know how casualty works, its sad that someone leaked it before she could get the news the proper way. Hopefully she can heal from this. I will continue to pray for her and her family at this time.
Its so easy NO Individual Phones down range I didn't have one in 05, 07 or 09 and I managed just fine, And of all the casualty's we had not one was notified unofficially. There are still ways to talk to your family and if needed the command can still shut it off.
As a spouse i totally agree Tim. One way to know for sure a friend has been notified is wait for my husband to call again once blackout is over. The arny process works for a reason, its a random official bc its hard to disassociate people who deliver such tragic news with the feelings that
follow. I wouldnt tell my even my best friend I knew first or talk to her until I was contacted. The army has an abundance of resources people so all family members understand these process. They include free childcare…no excuse not to educate yourself. If you are a spouse of a soilder its your job to know these things.
Its a shame how she found out, another spouse posted on facebook the offical letter stating the two kia's with names and the letter indicated that the familes were already notifed. That spouse regardless should not have posted that letter. Prayers go out to the familes!
I worked at the Ft. Campbell patient tracking office, and was responsible for tracking sick/wounded Soldiers for all the units at Ft. Campbell and was one of the first to know of any deaths. I also know the why the process is set up the way it is. When something down range happens the Soldiers start calling home immediately to let their spouses know they are ok before the black out trying to keep stress off their families. However, this should not happen at all for this very reason. The system is there to keep spouses not only of learning about the injury or death the wrong way but to keep spouses from being told of inaccurate or completely wrong information. This has happened before the other way around and a wife is told her husband has been killed when in fact he wasn’t and no notification came because there was none for her. The agony of waiting for that black sedan to pull up to confirm and waiting for hours… I had “friends” of a spouse come to the office one time because they had heard that a particular Soldier was wounded and wanted me to verify his status. Even though I had the information I could not give it to them for several reasons. First being I was not aware if huge Soldiers rear detachment knew of the incident and second I did not know if these were true friends who the spouse had asked to come or not. Not everyone in every unit are friends or have each others best interest in mind. The system is set up so that the spouse has all the correct information they need as well as people there to support them and assist them with child care, who to notify, provide meals for them, and make this awful and difficult time a bit less by helping and getting the facts. Is it perfect no, but it is better than having half the story and waiting and waiting to find out the real factual story. People with good intentions or not need to learn to keep their mouths shut! That includes the Soldiers and spouses alike.
Thank you for clarifying. No matter what business it is, government or not, military or civilian, there are operation procedures that may not be liked by all or guaranteed 100% effective, but they are there for a reason.
This story is so sad! I was told by a member of the FRG that my husband and all the soldiers with him were hit an IED and there were severe injuries but they couldn't tell me anything else. So I sat for days with only that information not knowing whether my husband was dead or alive and if he was alive how severely injured he was. So knowing what it's like to hear horrifying news but have no real closure and to still have hope that they are wrong and it isn't actually true, makes me feel so incredibly sorry for this woman and her family. It makes me sick that people hear news like this and run their mouths like its a juicy bit of gossip, instead of a heartbreaking, life changing situation. All I have to say is that after my exp with the FRG and other Army wives, I keep my distance and really want nothing to do with any of them.
Army spouses are often quite young and far, far away from the elders in their lives. Having seen for myself of my son's family and friends, it may often come down to inexperience and socially acceptable standards. It isn't right, it is sad, but I believe no military spouse ever means harm. Military spouse are as tough, if not tougher, than our soldiers; left on their own, often with children, while their spouse deploys into the danger of warzones… their emotions run high. Perhaps the answer is just more OJT with respect to security measures, why, and how to suppress the natural desire to communicate what they know (but should keep secret.) Don't point fingers at them… our military spouses are very, very special people.
I don't know if I will be welcome in this discussion, but here goes. I am Mrs. Born's aunt, and was with her when she was notified of her husbands death. She got a facebook message several hours earlier telling her they were sorry for her loss. It was from a spouse that she knew but was not close to. She called Fort Stewart and started asking questions. It took them a while to call her back. The Major that did the phone notification was without a doubt, one of the most compassionate men I have ever spoken with. It was clear that this was not how they wanted to handle the notification. But they did not want her sitting for hours waiting for the notification team. We live in a very rural area. The team arrived approximately 2 hours later. And they were truly wonderful. It is heartbreaking losing Sgt. Born. And it was devastating for her to find out the way she did. We are not a military family and I don't have a lot of experience with how the Army does things. But I will say this, I have the utmost respect for the Major from Fort Stewart. And for the Notification team. And for every single Army personnel that we have come in contact with. They have been extremely professional and extremely caring. You can tell that they are grieving for their own loss as well. Thank you.
Of course you are welcome. This whole situation is a difficult one to process, but I am glad that you can clarify the outcome of the situation and let people know that the Major and others involved were helpful. An explanation to any of us commenting is not necessary, but in my eyes greatly appreciated. My thoughts and prayers are with Mrs. Born and the rest of the family. May Sgt. Born Rest in Peace.
Myra, we, too, extend our condolences to Mrs. Born and your whole family. My family is north of you a bit, near Marion, and I know how rural the area is where you are located, so I know it would have added considerable time for the notification team to arrive. I am glad that the Major did call her back and did the best he could in the situation and told her the truth, with due compassion, and not give her the brush off until the notification team arrived.
The Major has actually called many times since that first awful day. I cannot say it enough, the Army has been incredible. They have gathered around Megan and insulated her from as much as possible. The Chaplin told her the first day that she would soon meet many Army "family" that had her needs first through this ordeal. He was absolutely correct. I admire you all so much, because you live with this possibility every day and I don't know how. I will pray more fervently for the safety of all our soldiers and for your peace of mind, while you patiently await their safe return.
Myra, I am so sorry for your families loss! I know my small words will hardly fill the hole that has been left in your family’s world but please know that I am really and truly so sorry for your loss. No spouse/family member should ever have to be notified this way, good intentions and all. It was a series of misfortunate events and as a military spouse I hurt for you all.
M,, I am so sorry for your families loss! I know my small words will hardly fill the hole that has been left in your family’s world but please know that I am really and truly so sorry for your loss. No spouse/family member should ever have to be notified this way, good intentions and all. It was a series of misfortunate events and as a military spouse I hurt for you all.
Its sad i wouldnt of wanted my wife to find our like that wifes need to learn their army role seen not heard. I hope the people that leaked this get whats coming to them. Opsec violation will end them!
Sorry to say….. it is not the ARMY SPOUSE WHO IS TO BLAME. Where do you think the wives get the info? Was the spouse down range? NO. Her soldier or a soldier told her. The break down came from down range. Soldiers know to follow OPSEC and not leak info about a fallen soldier and if a soldier has told his spouse, then you would assume it had already been released. I am so sorry she found out that way. I can't imagine what she was going through. My prayers are with her and her family.
It was a snowball affect that did start from where the incident occured but I’m sorry, these spouses are just as much to blame. Never should one ‘assume’ anything in instances like this.
It was a snowball affect that started where the incident occurred but I’m sorry, the spouses are just as much to blame. One should never ‘assume’ anything in instances like this.
I do not think the Army or the other military branches should do anything different. The blame rest solely with the individuals you did not considered this obviously young wife who was possibly facing her first deployment. Why can't we put the blame where it needs to be…with the military personnel who had the info and their spouse to whom they shared the info. Obviously the penalties are not stiff enough to detract from this behavior…it may seem small to some, but what if it were your loved one? I am so tired of people hiding behind what we have the right to know…how quick does military need to be? What if she was out of pocket, at the movies, or dinner with friends? What if they had to wait for her return to the house? Are we that impatient, face to face will always take longer.
This wife's hometown is about 70 miles from my own and my dad saw it on their local news and he told me about her finding out by Facebook message. I looked up the local news sites story on it and they reported that her mother said that the wife had talked to him Wednesday night and that she got the Facebook message Thursday morning. So given the time difference, she talked to him not too long before he was killed. But also given the time difference, she would have gotten that message seems like within a few hours of him being killed, so probably barely time for the RD to have notified her even if she had stayed at the base in Georgia, much less for the RD to have contacted CAO team closer to her location and gotten a team to her location. This is the story that ran back home about it: http://www.wsiltv.com/news/video/Soldier-Killed-1…
It was a snowball affect that did start from where the incident occured but I’m sorry, these spouses are just as much to blame. Never should someone ‘assume’ anything in instances like this.
I have been an Army wife for over 16 years and I have always refused to stay away from the gossip crap. I refuse to have anything to do with the FRG and other spouses within my husbands unit. I married my husband before he joined so we went into this together. I know about all the protocals and what should and shouldn't happen. I just can not understand why another wife would do such a thing. I mean if you want to check on her wait a few days, at least that way you would know the news got to her! Just goes to show you how young,immature and uncaring some Army wives are. Shame on everyone involved!
I worked Personnel Records when I was in the Army, and I told my parents never believe it if someone would call them. Only believe if a Officer shows up on there door step. I had a soldier on year that I was in-processing in to our Div. where someone called his mother and told her he was dead. Needless she was by her self taking care of his 2 year old and she freaked out and they had to put her in a Mental hosp. There also had to bring him back on a emergency reassignment back to the states. So wives next time you want to text something think, before you do it and let the officials do there job.
Spouse and soldier were to blame here. It is not appropriate to relay information just because you have knowledge of it, I even being just a spouse know this. It is a lack of consideration.
Having a big mouth is not anything anyone should be proud of. Its a pity that anyone would even think to do such a thing.
When my husband was injured and his wing man killed and his gunner at deaths door an embedded reporter let him use her satellite phone to call me. I knew before rear D had all the details. I keep my mouth shut. At 5 a.m. I got a phone call from the mother of the young man who had been KIA. She just said to me 'Its Jakes Mom, how is your husband?" How can that wonderful woman who just found out about her son not 7 hours earlier be calling me to check and see if my husband was alive? Broke my heart! Even she did not divulge anything in her grief. I knew more info then ANYBODY and I was scared, worried and sick all at the same time but I keep my mouth SHUT until I knew that the family was notified. I am sorry but it is not that hard of a thing to do. (Oh and my husband told me that if I said anything he would never talk to me again but he felt that I had the right to know what happened to HIM. I kept his trust!)
Christine, this is the most mature, classiest post I have seen. I'm a Navy spouse and I have never experienced the types of things that have previously been posted by Army spouses. After 25 years, being an ombudsman, participating in multiple wonderful spouses groups and 3 CO tours, I've learned that you take in the information that your husband provides, keep your mouth shut, keep your ears open (and pass on this info to your husband), never gossip. And stand by and get ready to help. My reaction (when my husband told me something in confidence) was always to cook or bake and clear my schedule to provide child care, transportation, etc. Whatever to help the affected spouse even before she knows she needs help. It is not our business to interfere with the official chain of command but I believe it is our responsibility to support our fellow spouses. Thank you and your spouse for your service.
FACEBOOK AND A TEXT! That is the dumbest and worst thing I have ever heard of! The worst place for anything to get out is on Facebook. Everyone thinks everything on there is true. Never post ANYTHING like that because it could hurt someone. I may have one but it's because it's a good way to keep in touch with friends. Cause not all of them have a phone but all of them have a facebook. And Christ I feel grievence for that woman. That is the most disrespectful and unworthy way to recieve the notification of your spouses death. I would like to smack the person who told her. Because it was an utter disgrace. Please let the officials do their jobs. If you do then stupid things woudn't happen and I wouldn't have to question what kind of world that we're living in. Because I would for that to happen if I ever get married. For one day my husband be sittibg there and suddenly his phone buzzes and one of his friends tell him that I'm dead. Again respect and let the officials do there jobs. Thanks.
Sorry bout the one coppied. My cousin thought that it would be funny to get on my comp while I was talking to my mom and to put it up there again.
The worst place for anything to get out is on Facebook. Everyone thinks everything on there is true. I may have one but it's because it's a good way to keep in touch with friends. Cause not all of them have a phone but all of them have a facebook. And Christ I feel grievence for that woman. That is the most disrespectful and unworthy way to recieve the notification of your spouses death. I would love ot see the person who told her's face right now with reading all of these comments. Because it was an utter disgrace. Please let the officials do their jobs. If you do then stupid things woudn't happen and I wouldn't have to question what kind of world that we're living in. Because I would for that to happen if I ever get married. For one day my husband be sittibg there and suddenly his phone buzzes and one of his friends tell him that I'm dead. Again respect and let the officials do there jobs. Thanks.
Not that I ever want to experience the "dark sedan, 2 men in uniform, and knock" scene from a movie..I personally think it would be hard to ever replace the "proper dignity and respect" that comes along with it. Yes the news of your spouses death will be hard regardless of what form you receive it in but it's just more comforting to receive it the old fashioned way and not by some soulless form of communication.
Additionally, I am not to sure about how fast blackouts come into play but I think it should happen immediately. Soldiers I know for a fact a lot of times reveal things they shouldn't reveal even to their spouse. Soldiers need to stop doing this. On top of that military spouses should STOP spreading sensitive information around, at least until the person of interest is properly notified. BE CONSIDERATE. I wonder how the people who texted and FB'd Mrs. Born would feel if someone did the exact same thing to them. If the military would implement some 'reasonably' strict rules when it comes to the spouses and family members, I would surely follow. This I think would somehow help us all go in the right direction of living a true military lifestyle or at least lead us in the right direction to fix issues such as this.
Lastly, I am entitled to express my opinion and so are you but please keep your negativity to yourself, Thank you :)
There are situations when a troop is hurt, or KIA that blackout does not happen or happen quick enough. So a Soldier in the unit might make a facebook comment along the lines of "R.I.P. (insert Soldiers name here) You will be missed" then a mutual friend sees that back home and makes a post about it, then it goes on from there. We are trained that if an incident happens we are under blackout conditions (even if they didn't flip the switch). My last deployment we did UCMJ action on two Soldiers who did just that, Not intending to violate OPSEC but just trying to pay respect for a fallen comrade. It is a messed up situation for loved ones to find out that way. But all the training is not going to help until people actually see the consequences of the actions even unintentional actions.
My neighbor's dad died the other day. When she didn't show up to our walking group I wondered where she was… The other ladies told me what happened.
I sent her a text that said, "I am so sorry to hear about your Dad. I lost my father 2 years ago and I want you to know I am here and I understand."
When my Dad died phone calls often came when I was crying with my stepmother or making funeral arrangements. Voicemails were too raw and I couldn't make myself listen. But the texts, the texts I read and I appreciated.
I have lost no less than 12 friends to combat operations. Every educated spouse I know sends a text message asking:
When can I bring a meal?
What time can I pick up the dog to take him for a run for you?
I'm going to the park, let me take your children with me.
The Army has ingrained in us that by the time "the spouses" hear the news the families have been contacted. There is no wiggle room. That is a fact. As an Army spouse, that is what the Army has told me for 20 years and that is how it has been.
If ANY spouse heard the news and the family had not been contacted than that IS the result of a Soldier or the Command speaking out of turn. I'm disgusted as a 20-year-Army-spouse that "spouses to blame" would EVER be an Army tagline.
I don't know anyone involved in this situation. What I do know is that I have not seen the text of the text in any article.
Forgive me, if I err on the side of "she was just saying she was sorry" and the whole situation is a tragedy.
Here's the plain and simple fact of the matter.
People can make all the excuses they want. Nobody else's wife should know who died before their own family. Period. The soldier did the poor woman a disservice by blabbing it to his own wife, who then furthered the disservice by blasting it on Facebook.
If my husband, who is currently deployed, were to ever try to tell me who exactly died, I'd tell him to not tell me. I do not deserve to know first. The soldier's family does, the soldier's wife does. The soldier's CHILDREN deserve to know first. I can understand, partially, if the soldier who died was a close friend or colleague, but that grief probably should have been taken to someone else. I know, we wives lean on our husbands, and they can lean on us if it was someone close. But for the sake of protecting the one who will HURT THE MOST, she should have been thought of first. She vowed to spend the rest of her life with him. She, along with his family, will hurt more. It was a disservice to him and her for people to go sputtering this everywhere.
I can also understand why the text happened. If I read the article correctly, it said she had moved back to Illinois. If the two spouses were still in Stewart, they can't just come knocking. However, a better idea for that idiot who texted, would have been to send a more discreet text to find out whether or not she knew. Simply by asking "Is everything okay with you? How are you doing?" That would have given her the opportunity to find out whether the wife knew, but for some reason, some of these spouses don't know how to apply their brain cells properly.
Bottom line, there is no excuse. If you get emails from FRG, you likely get notifications about a death, and you will be given a name when the family has been notified. If you don't have that email, then they likely haven't been notified. Keep your mouth shut.
Bottom line? The families of the deceased deserve to know first. Do not blab to your spouse, do not blab on Facebook, and for heaven's sake, do not send a text without being positive whether she knows or not. There were a lot of assumptions made by these two spouses, and neither of them had that woman's best interests at heart.
Spouses need to remember to have some maturity, discretion, and class. This isn't your monthly coffee, these are peoples' lives, and this woman will have to remember, for the rest of her life, how she discovered that her husband died. If you are to ever hear of a soldier's death, and you don't know if the spouse knows, keep this story in mind before you open your mouth, post on Facebook, or send a text. Think about the family of the soldier before yourself.
I understand and I gree wtih most of what you post. But I have to disagree with the fact that a husband may have shared the news with his spouse as a wrong thing. It is imperative that we put responsibility on that couple alone. No one knows what the circumstances were for the one soldier who told his wife. what should have happened is that the spouse and the soldier should have had the common sense and sensibility to know what is appropriate or inappropriate.
many husbands want to spare their wives the pain of thinking is them….specially because the media will blurr out that someone died in such area, from such company or service branch..and lets face it….as military spouses and if the husbands or wives are communicating as much as they can and things are well, we know the whereabouts of our significant others. Nothing worse than waiting and not knowing if it was you who will receive the knock on the door.
So in short, it is about class, respect, sense, and responsibility. We all know posting on Fb is inapropriate, cold, and nothing but a desire for drama.
Secondly, after this; it is almost certain that the Army will change the way units pass info to the FRGs…hopefully there is a better way. Still, it all lays on the hands of those who know to do the right thing.
Thirdly, when reading the main article…how does the mother text her daughter? unacceptable and deplorable. she should have called or driven to her house to join with her in the search for answers.
About the command, it says they confirmed the death over the phone? for heavens sake…rear detachment commanders should know better and attempt to correct the situation as best as possible..he was a bozzo.
and for the one that posted such thing online….class is what she needs….close friends of Mrs. Megan? I do not think so…because then that would have never happened…it was an unscrupulous and thoughtless act.
For the soldier who told his wife….spare your wife the thinking that you may have passed, but have a talk with her about how there are ways the Army deals with things for a reason.
#####'th fighter squadron this is AMN _______. How may I help you?
…
I am sorry Mrs ______, we are not allowed to give any information over the phone at this time.
…
If I can get your phone number and address we will contact you as soon as we have information we can give you.
…
I am sorry ma'am we can not give out any airman's location at this time; I can not even call my own parents to let them know I was not deployed with the group there. I know that you are concerned and even worried but we do not give out any information over the phone until all next of kin have been properly notified. May I get your Phone number and your address so that we can contact you as soon as we are able to give out information.
…
(45 minutes later)
…
Ma'am our acting first sargent just walked in maybe he can help you more than I can let me get him on the phone. (phone on mute) SGT______, MRS ________ is on the phone she is trying to contact her son (me pointing one finger (#1) at the white board with the names of the men we lost and have not found next of kin because some had moved while we had been deployed); I have been on with her for 45 minutes and shes not willing to give me her contact information.
—————————————
I took the SGT' s coffee order and went and made a pot… After delivering the coffee to the skeleton crew of people that all out ranked me by several stripes or bars. I returned to the SGT who was on the phone still and handed me an envelope with contact information and a note saying that there was no speed limit on base any more and where to take the envelope… doors I had no authority to pass buzzed open every time I got close running that envelope into the command post set up in the wing emergency HQ.
Oddly under duress I still see the walls of that office and hear that woman's voice and smell that place. I delivered 6 more of those envelopes over the next day, and there were several others that came back to our squadron and they all were delivered with out regard to personal safety or speed limits. An S-10 will make it 0 to 80 twice in just over a quarter mile and there is no faster way to contact the next of kin with out loosing the respect every one of those notifications deserve.
—–
2 hours after I had that address to deliver to the wing HQ building the acting shirt hung up the phone and smiled at me briefly as he let the tears fall down his face. He said I could go to diner that they had someone knocking on her door. I left closing the door behind me and heard him doing what I wanted to do as well and couldn't. When I came back from not eating dinner (I tried) there was another packet.
Later I was told I had a call from overseas. It was a friend that had been previously stationed at the base I was at and we had spent weekends driving around the UK before I left the base he was at. Turns out that he was a very close friend of the AMN that I had taken the call from his mom… I still couldn't tell him over the phone and had to send him to the base chaplains office to request information. The shirt let me pull this fast one only because the mother had been notified already and I had to let the base chaplain know right away that he was coming for information and that it was bad news.
———-
Despite this being rather traumatic to the junior airman on the phone keeping the respect for the fellow airman's next of kin alive by not telling her over the phone wrongly. Despite the fact that this was the fourth mother I had spoken to that day and ended up not being able to talk to any more because of how close I was to breaking down into tears and that I still dream about that damn call. There is no way to notify families that will ever properly replace the sedan and knock by the men and women in dress blues. To do otherwise is grossly disrespectful.
—–
sorry long post but … I can't read through it again to thin it out. Hope this helps make sense of why it is so important not to leak stuff like this through twitter, facebook, email or any other means.
Sorry that was from my life about 17 years ago this summer. We were told we'd see Leavenworth if we leaked anything before next of kin got the message rightly. I don't think we needed to have why explained then.
Being a Army “wife” I have seen first hand the damage some spouses cause and when I took over the FRG oh my lord it was one big gossip machine and fight fest. This text message incident takes the cake though. Being a male spouse makes it better because I don’t get lumped in with the wives and if you took a poll people already don’t think to highly of Army wives. I tell you this though if another spouse informs me by text my wife was killed by text I’m not only drop kicking the spouse I’m drop kicking the soldier also! I’m an old sailor the things I see from Army life makes me shake my head sometimes in disbelief!
It is not just the families – I served as the family readiness volunteer when my husband was in Iraq – when it was announced on the news that a solider had been lost in the area that our soldiers were deployed – the Atlanta Journal would start calling soliders families saying that they had heard it was their soldier, they would say this to children even. My families made it a rule that there children were not allowed to answer the home phone. I did not know who the fallen soldier was till the family was notified and then the state would call and give me the information so we could help the family.
I am a Navy Vet, My sister just retired Navy, Brother in law Navy, My father was Army, Air Force. This is why I HATE FACEBOOK AND TWITTER!! Putting too much information out there for everyone to see!! Some things just need to be kept PRIVATE!!!
"Spouses to blame" is never the right response. That command should have ensured that this information was disseminated properly, no questions asked.
Technology, and our reliance on it, are becoming a bigger problem the longer this war goes on. Towards the beginning of this whole endeavor you could go weeks without hearing from a loved one. As time has passed I hear more often than not that people are hearing from their loved ones on an almost daily basis. Personally, as much as I hated not hearing from my husband during his deployments, I think this is something the military needs to look at in more detail. Giving such carte blanche access to FB, email, Twitter, etc., is doing more harm than good – for both the military members and the loved ones at home. OPSEC is always going to be an issue because there are people that thrive on being the first to know or being "in the know". I'd like to say that this wife finding out over a text is an anomoly, however, I know spouses that have found out via email or through the "rumor mill'. It's disgusting. Until the military steps in and takes away some of the technology for those that are forward-deployed this is going to continue to be a problem.
What is the rule in these situations? What exactly does Blackout communications mean? I don't know about some Soldiers in this situation, but to me it always meant: NO COMMS, period! So, some Soldiers knowingly disobeyed orders, relayed information to one or some spouses, and the information got out. The spouses, while guilty of totally, incredibly stupid behavior, are not responsible…those responsbile are the Soldiers and their leadership who let this happen. It will not stop until or unless Army leadership decides to stand by its order and hold Soldiers accountable under UCMJ action. Perhaps then folks will learn to understand the meaning of no communication and just how very, very hurtful their actions have been to Families put through this kind of ordeal.
OPSEC is the most difficult role to implement in the military. I an open society things will leak. We can but do our best and include training that emphasizes sensitivity and consequences unintended fom the leak of even trivial information at the wrong place and time…
Emotionally exhausted is a state that most military spouses are in virtually 100% of the time, regardless of their spouse’s deployment status. Military life–deployments not withstanding–is just plain tough, and not for everyone. I don’t care what kind of emotional stress you are under as a military spouse: don’t let your emotions get in the way of doing your JOB. We have the hardest job in the military, any solider will tell you that. They expect us to honor that job and not screw up like this. If you can’t handle being a military spouse and the extra duties it will require of you, don’t be one. Period.
I have a problem with the headline. To me, it implies that the Army did somehting wrong and is deverting the blame onto spouses. Headlines should not be hit pieces, but they are on this site. The headline should have read something like, "Army spouses responsible for KIA notification by text."
The title and first paragraph of this article/post/whatever are drawing a lot of reactions here about the Army pointing fingers at spouses. That's pretty misleading because I don't see a quote anywhere in this blog post where the Army PAO actually said that, or even words to that effect.
There's one quote from the PAO. Everything else is summary and/or exposition by Amy. Not the PAO. Yet the title of this blog post reads like a direct attribution.
Apparently one or more people downrange leaked the word, and then families/friends in the rear started spreading the word, and that's how the family found out. It would seem both spouses and Soldiers are to blame. But the title of the article makes it sound like the Army PAO is throwing spouses under the bus. Those appear to be Amy's words, not the PAO's.
Amy, if you have a quote to back up your statement that the PAO actually said "spouses were to blame," please post it. Otherwise, don't attribute statements to the PAO if that's not what they said.
I think the blame is the people down range. The article never said that the spouse sent a text that said your husband died. The widow wasn't even in Georgia so the guilty spouse might have said that she was sorry for the loss of her husband not knowing that the widow wasn't notified yet. I think there should be an investigation on who leaked the information and stop blaming the spouse because she was probably trying to console a fellow spouse.
Maj. D — as you requested: He had previously in our conversation (quoted above in the post) made it clear that he was talking about "spouses" and "families" when he referred to people. He used the phrases interchangeably.
And here is the quote supporting the summary that he blamed spouses for the problem: "For people to assume that a family has been notified — it's exactly that, it's an assumption. And it's unfortunate when people circumvent that process and assume that they already know. You can't assume that they already know that their loved one is gone. "
It sounds like someone close to him downrange was upset. They told their spouse as a ways of expressing their grief. The spouse then told others. And a firestorm was off and running.
No on really wants to find out their loved one has died via social networking. However, it is happening all over the world. Syria, Libya, other war zones. Tim Hetherington and others. It is a very unfortunate way to happen, though quite honestly, there isn't a good or easy way your loved one has died.
But the military has protocols that are set in tradition with the aim of upholding the solemnity of the news and also the dignity of everyone affected –including the deceased. We should respect and stay with it.
Cordially,
Kanani Fong
It just makes me sick to know how many women out there don't have anything better to do than to pry into the sacredness of family privacy. Some people need to start using a primitive skill called COMMON SENSE!
This a shame. The whole facebook, i-phone, whatever thing is out of hand and honestly it's stupid. I'm into technology and IT and I still don't get the craze but then, I never did crazes. Wherever you go people are on these devices giving them and whatever silly information is there their maximum attention. People step out onto busy streets glued to them, I've seen nurses in ICU's giving "one on one" care going onto their phones and pads like if they wait another minute they'll miss something.
And you know, the opportunity to post a first, like this idiot did, well can't pass that up can we… blab, blab, blab…
I've been an army spouse for 24+ years, and in that time – I've gone through plenty of blackouts. During those times – it goes without saying that there has been a casualty. Sometimes, at that point, spouses begin to play detective — not in an effort to undermine the system or be the "first" to know… but instead to begin their own process of elimination in order to make an educated guess on whether or not it's their own spouse. As well – the blame for this horrible situation rests squarely on the soldier who couldn't resist the temptation to get the word out to a spouse. It's all inexcusable, of course, but to fix the problem, you have to get to the root – and that's the spouse in theater.
Having seen firsthand the idiocy of some military spouses (and yes, I am a military spouse as well) during the current deployment, I can absolutely believe that this happened. Sometimes calls get through before the blackout is instigated and then you have a 'perfect storm' for awful things like this to happen.
I am frankly appalled at the lack of common sense that I see all around me, and this does not apply to just young military spouses. We had a casualty, sadly, and a senior enlisted spouse ran down the street in one of the communities and yelled to some of her aquaintances about it without knowing if the NOK had been notified or if the chain of concern had been activated. It was ridiculous.
Keep your mouths shut, people. This isn't some stupid reality show, this is REAL life and people's feelings MUST be taken into consideration.
Incidents such as this are what makes military spouses look bad, and that's a shame.